Cooking out with the firedragon

[mrcharly]

Unable to find my home-made meths stove and wanting something cheap and compact, I bought a firedragon stove and fuel
http://bcbin.com/product/firedragon-folding-cooker-mk-ii/
I got the fuel from Cotswolds camping who incidentally are one of the cheapest sources at £2.50 for 6 blocks.

3 blocks will fit in the folded cooker for storage, which makes it a very tiny package for packpacking. I was cycle camping with small panniers and a saddlebag, so only had about 40l total volume for tent, sleeping gear etc.

I used it with a heavy foil windshield that completely surrounded the pan and went up its sides, and a 20cm stainless pan. Lots of tests describe using small canteen-style pans; which might be why I got better results.

I used one block, boiled about 500ml of water and then fried an onion and halloumi. It was warmish weather (about 16C) but windy.
In the morning (very, very windy), I fried up the remainder of the halloumi and heated a small tin of beans with a half-block.

That's pretty good, since you can carry 3 blocks within the cooker, making it very very compact, compared a meths burner plus a bottle of meths. If you were doing hot drinks and 3 meals a day you would use probably 4 blocks a day. A block weighs 27gm. Based on my experience I'd happily budget on 4 blocks for a weekend trip if I were only going to cook twice a day and not rely on making hot drinks as well.

 

[Jaeger]

Aye Up mrchly,

Have you tried it in the winter with temps around 0 yet?

 

[fuchsiashockz]

Looks good. I'm also looking to switch to solid fuel for a coastal hike soon.

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[mrcharly]

I used it how I described; obviously if the water is colder, it will take more heat to bring to the boil.

Still, I think it performed very well. I was impressed. For weekend summer trips it is a very good option. Simpler and cheaper by far than most gas systems, more compact than a trangia setup. Easier to carry than a meths burner plus bottle of meths (and no reason why it would perform much differently from a normal meths burner.

Given the 'loose' flame, I think the key is to have a large-bottomed pan and a tall windshield. I had both and it worked well.

One thing I neglected to mention; when you open out the burner, there are 3 distinct positions for the fold-up sides. Make sure you click the sides up into those positions or it can slip shut under the weight of your pan.

 

[Tonyuk]

If you peel the foil back by about a quarter and light it it'll burn for a good deal longer, but the plastic melts to the sides so can really only be done a few times before the cooker is done. Try to get 2 and use both windshields + dig it into the ground a bit.

Tonyuk

 

[mrcharly]

Tony - rather than do that (and end up with melted and half-burnt plastic) why not just cut chunks off the block of fuel and burn a chunk at a time?

 

[CLEM]

I've been using Fire Dragon for around two years now and I have been very impressed with its performance. Definitely a step up from hexi and the green snot to be sure. Just recently I bought the same stove as yourself Mrcharly and again impressed, extremely compact and does the job and then some ����

 

[fuchsiashockz]

Interestingly, the military are switching over to this from hex stoves.

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[CLEM]

Interestingly, the military are switching over to this from hex stoves.

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I believe this was done quite some time ago already in fact.

 

[MikeLA]

Still prefer Hexi just better and you can burn any packaging

 

[mrcharly]

What is it about the hexi that you find better, Mike? Hotter? Burns longer? or something else?

 

[Countryman]

I believe this was done quite some time ago already in fact.

Word from the herd is that Hexi gives of fumes with long term liability consequences.


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[MikeLA]

word from the herd is that Hexi gives of fumes with long term liability consequences........... Only in confined spaces otherwise no problem

Find hexi burns hotter don't like the plastic packaging of the new stuff and the fact it, as I have read it, has to be kept in this till used

Hexi : Prefer the bigger stove with the top for the metal mug

Hexi :Once used not a thing to carry, waxed paper burns

Most of all I break up the hexi blocks into quarters at home before a trip and carry them in a bag, so can fed the stove with the right amounts. The new stuff is thicker and harder to break and has to be done in the field not at home.

 

[mrcharly]

I can't comment about the stove, since I haven't used the old one.

Agreed about waste afterwards, the bits of plastic left over are a nuisance.

The new stuff isn't 'hard to break'; it is a gel, you can slice it with a butter knife. Once you've opened a container of the block, you can wrap it in a sandwich bag or clingfilm to stop it evaporating.

 

[Jaeger]

Aye Up,

I thought that I'd posted on this some time ago after winter use of the new(ish) BCB stove and FD fuel but a search didn't turn it up(?) so here is the main body of it and with an update!

First early-early morning. It’s *@&! Cold!
BCB cooker, 1 x gel tab, half a litre of cold H20 in an Austrian stainless mug with a lid. Gel tab goes out at 12 mins (timing courtesy of Apple) NO BOIL!
Second tab inserted (mind yer fingers! lol), water rolling boils at 16 mins - tab burns out at 22 mins.
Can I improve on that boil time?

Several hours later – BCB cooker, same mug/lid, plumbers ins mat beneath, 1 x gel tab. Goes out at 10 mins NO BOIL!
Second tab inserted – rolling boil at 13 mins – improvement!
BUT! Wasted fuel on both occasions; bottom of mug blackened but not sticky like hexe; Plastic waste material left in stove and x2 plastic tab containers and foil lids to dispose of (those are going to be a CSM’s nightmare! Lol).

Next outing (a week later and after some thought) - late night deployment.
BCB cooker, same mug/lid/mat; 1 x full gel tab + 1 tab cut up to fill cooker fuel receptacle. (equiv approx 1.25 tabs).
Rolling boil @ 10 mins – reesult!
Tabs burned on until 16 mins.


BCB/FD fuel conclusions –

Tactically better than hexe; lower flame signature and better flame containment;
It isn’t odourless – (think 1970’s speedway!). It is low odour and nothing like as distinctive as hexe (I love the smell of hexe in the mornings though );
It’s less easy than hexe to dump out of the stove whilst burning and quickly close it up (if yer mum (read csm!) is calling yer in for yer tea!).

Best result when the whole of the fuel receptacle is filled – greater burning surface area;
Best result with an insulating material beneath the stove – prevents heat sink.
1 x Gel tab slightly too small to boil 500ml H20 – x 1 tab ought to be made to fill the fuel receptacle;
Waste packaging from gel tabs – yes it does burn but – try it.
Waste residue from gel tabs – (the polymer stiffener I assume) – disposal?
Stove possibly best used with bottled gel to fill fuel receptacle and limit wasted fuel tabs.
(Working on a less easily punctured container for it though!).

Ref that last point – I tried the stove with Fire Dragon bottled gel – same conditions – completely full fuel receptacle - gel burned out at 11.5 mins – NO BOIL!
Repeated practice – same result?

I recall speaking with a person involved with development of the stove/fuel(s) who agreed that the polymer stiffener might be adding extra calories to the tabs.

Since that post I have trial-ed (not in winter yet though!) the plastic bottles that mosi repellent from Lifesystems and reproof spray from Grangers comes in as a better container for the FD 'liquid' gel fuel and found that it is a far more versatile (multi use) option than the tabs. (image 1) (flammable sticker courtesy of local car parts shop)


The bottles are compact, fairly robust and hold easily enough for a weekends outing. Plus less after-burn residue and no litter! (I've kept a close eye on the bottles to check for leaks, none so far after several months). They also slot nicely in a ruck side pouch - tools in my case. (image 2)


You may find that the original FD bottle nozzle fits the mosi rep/reproofer bottle so you still get the control when pouring (squeezing) the fuel out.

You can fill the BCB stove tray completely or add extra to a solid gel tab if using those (before lighting!).
I've used it to start any number of other stoves - as a pre heat gel for my SATs, kero and petrol stoves and the BRS wood burner.
I wouldn't use it INSIDE a meths burner though - might clog it after a while.

It also serves well as a controlled dispenser for the gel if you need to use the fuel as a hand cleaner/sanitiser.
I've done this a few times recently after inflicting small cuts on fingers so my burner fuel has effectively also become an extension of my FAK! (I love multi purpose gear )

 

[mrcharly]

That's useful info.
I think with the loose washy flame you get that using these stoves with a big flat bottomed pan is more efficient than using something like a mug. A pan that you can eat out of for multi-purpose, definitely.

The tabs are best used if you need something compact and don't want to carry a fuel bottle. Being able to fit 3 inside the stove is very useful.

 

[MikeLA]

I can't comment about the stove, since I haven't used the old one.

Agreed about waste afterwards, the bits of plastic left over are a nuisance.

The new stuff isn't 'hard to break'; it is a gel, you can slice it with a butter knife. Once you've opened a container of the block, you can wrap it in a sandwich bag or clingfilm to stop it evaporating.

its the fact you have to do that in the first place that bugs me a bit

 

[peaks]

As its alcohol based, do you think that keeping the tabs or gel warm in cold weather (like you'd do with meths)
would make any difference?

 

[Jaeger]

Aye Up,

Interesting thought Peaks but as the FD fuel - solid/liquid gel doesn't rely on gasification as per the liquid-to-gas process when using meths in for example a SVEA/Trangia I doubt that it will make a difference.

 

[Hammock_man]

It will take a bit longer for the tab to burn from very cold, as with all exothermic reactions, but it will be all the other items ( water, pot, holder, air! ) that will effect the burn time more. You only need to get a very small part of the tab up to temp for it to maintain the flame. A lot of the meths burner and fuel need to be up to temp to get it going and stay lit.