Camo question

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EdS

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Well it is that time of year to go and watch the local badgers. However, having looked in my wardrobe all of my top appear to be bright or black. So I'm thinking of getting a camo shirt/jacket to wear over top.

I've got British DPM and flecktarn trousers so what colour top should I go for. Also any problems with mixing and matching camo styles?
 

bambodoggy

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Nov 10, 2004
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EdS said:
Well it is that time of year to go and watch the local badgers. However, having looked in my wardrobe all of my top appear to be bright or black. So I'm thinking of getting a camo shirt/jacket to wear over top.

I've got British DPM and flecktarn trousers so what colour top should I go for. Also any problems with mixing and matching camo styles?

Most animals seeing in black and white Mate so cammo simply isn't needed...all you want to do is break up your shape and blur your outlines and you don't need dpm or flectarn for that.

In the states you can get dayglow hunting vests which you have to wear by law in some states but they are often a sort of dayglow DPM...this is so that other hunters can see them and hopefully not shoot each other by mistake but by being patterned they still help to camm up the hunter.

If you want dpm then be all means wear it but the only things that it'll help hide you from is other poeple..lol :D

Why not sit yourself down and throw an old blanket over yourself to break up your shape and keep you warm at the same time :cool:

Hope that's of use to you,

Bam.
 

C_Claycomb

Moderator staff
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Oct 6, 2003
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I have been told that deer can see in colour, but only close up. Badgers have pretty poor eye sight at any distance so being quiet and scent control are more important than camo.

On the other hand, birds see very well in colour and by wearing full camo, during the day, birds will often miss you. By not alarming the birds, the whole wood is not alerted to your presence.

In most cases I feel that DPM is too dark a pattern, at night it shows up more than regular OG, and only really seems to come into its own in deep woodland. I like the American Realtree patterns, if you can get some with a lot of green in them. Most US hunting patters are too grey/brown for this country. Also beware of paterns that are incredibly detailed on a small scale, like Mossy Oak Break-up. At a distance it looks dark grey and stands out in except in dreary winter woods. The Brown Realtree tends to have a very tan background with I reckon matches a lot of soils and bark colours.

Some of the lighter plaid in greys, browns or greens work pretty well. Soft finish fabrics are better than those with a hard "abrasion resistant" finish, they are quieter, but also don't reflect sun.

I think the most important part of my camo is my gloves and face mask. In the woods the face and hands can almost glow like beacons.

They used to sell mesh over garments in camo. A jacket, trousers, gloves and face mask that would go on over other clothes. You could wear a white T-shirt and jeans, and no hint of white or blue would show through. The only problem was that they tended to snag on brush. Good for sitting still in though.
 

NickBristol

Forager
Feb 17, 2004
232
0
Bristol, UK
You could try making a more 'tactical' solution - make some simple loops out of 1inch wide black or green elasticated fabric, some for the arms, some for the legs, bigger ones for the chest / shoulders. Simply pull them on over your jacket and trousers, then stuff under the elastic a variety of foliage from where you choose to do your nature watching to distort or blur your outline.

Just remember to pull all the foliage off for the walk back to civilisation, you do tend to look a little strange to passing folk :)
 

Doc

Need to contact Admin...
Nov 29, 2003
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Perthshire
I never wear camo - I've never worn it as a civilian, although the Realtree patterns are certainly less 'military' in appearance. And more expensive.

I do have a sheet of Realtree Wetlands material to build a hide with when wildfowling. It is made of a J-cloth like fabric, with punched out bits that flap in the breeze. Very strong, light, pack size about a litre. Good in wetland/foreshore most of the year, and good in the woods in Autumn/winter, when the predominant colour is yellow, not green. You can also get it in woodland realtree patterns for summer woodland use. I have had a fox come within touching distance using this sort of hide. For static wildlife observation a hide disguises your shape better than clothing.
 

Dorian Gra

Member
May 19, 2005
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I great cammo pattern is the advantage real tree range. These have digital imaging of woodland and make you very well hidden. If you don't want to spend much you can get a cheap waterproof and breathable ones on ebay shipped straight form the U.S. for abut £15 for the jacket (dunno how good they would be for that)
Hope this helps :D
 

bambodoggy

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C_Claycomb said:
On the other hand, birds see very well in colour and by wearing full camo, during the day, birds will often miss you. By not alarming the birds, the whole wood is not alerted to your presence.

I'd say for watching badgers this really isn't important Mate, it's dark and there aren't many birds about when badgers come out to play, besides even if birds do see in colour they will be seeing colours all day...cars that they fly over, bluebells in the woods and other manmade and natural colour so one person wearing colour won't bother them....what will bother them is that person moving and as you can't watch the birds all the time they will see you moving...the best bet is just to move carefully and only when you really have too. It's the movement that will give you away...not your colour or cammo and that applies to the badgers and deer too :)

C_Claycomb said:
They used to sell mesh over garments in camo. A jacket, trousers, gloves and face mask that would go on over other clothes. You could wear a white T-shirt and jeans, and no hint of white or blue would show through. The only problem was that they tended to snag on brush. Good for sitting still in though.

Again, for the above reason it wouldn't make the slightest difference if I was wearing blue jeans and a white t-shirt...it's the movement that'll give you away. It is a good idea to cover your head and shoulders though but this is to break up the outline and not to change the colour.

I've stalked up pretty close to many deer when I've been out wearing jeans and a t-shirt and it's really not an issue.

Now if you're stalking humans.....that's a different story and everything you say is spot on Mate :)

It's good to talk about these preconcieved ideas people have on how you should do things :D

Again for the above reasons Doc's hide idea is spot on...in a hide there is no movement and so it works really well. Hence I suggested an old blanket over you to watch the badgers...it's like a portable hide and will break up your shape.
 

C_Claycomb

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http://whitetail.com/camo1.html

This makes for an interesting read. I love the last couple photos with the special Hawaiian camo :D

EdS, as you might gather, there isn't any problem mixing and matching. If all you want to do is watch badgers, then I wouldn't really be too worried about camo as such. Most of the time, with most animals, it will only add a few percentages to your concealment. Silhouette, shine from skin or cloth, shape and movement are more important.

I bought my camo clothing for airgun hunting years back. I believe that it worked and that the few percentage points it gave me were worth the investment. I doubt very much whether I would bother buying more camo now because I no longer have much chance to hunt and watching animals is generally much less demanding than close range hunting. I still reckon that hiding your face and hands can pay big dividends.

In camo I have stood still, in the open, and had foxes come sniff at me, bed down withing feet of me, and weave back and forth trying to work out what I am. Sitting still on the ground I have had pigeons perch next to me and walk within a yard of my feet. I don't believe I am a good enough woodsman to get away with that in jeans and a t-shirt, even if it is do-able for some.


Oh, I used to get a big kick out of being invisible to people too :D lol
 

bambodoggy

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Nov 10, 2004
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C_Claycomb said:
Oh, I used to get a big kick out of being invisible to people too :D lol

Lol...I'm with you there buddy....it always amuses me when I stand up and ask people only a few feet away to be quiet as I'm trying to listen to the animals...followed by the "Where the heck did you come from" look on their faces! lol :D
 

Ogri the trog

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Apr 29, 2005
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Spend your money on something else,
Mix and match your clothing and your camo, it won't make a huge difference. For Badger watching, scent, noise and movement are the ones that will spoil you evening.

Scent
Forget the aftershave and antiperspirant, leave out the fabric softener (even better, leave your outer garments outside for a few days, then dry them off to wear). Take cold, bland food and drink (no flask of hot coffee, and no spicey snacks).

Noise,
Turn off the mobile phone, wrap the car keys in a handkerchief. Wear soft soled shoes & walk slowly and quietly.

Movement,
Try to cover your face & hands (as these are the body-parts that are almost impossible to keep still) If you are taking binoculars, hold them near your face so that there will be less movement to actually look through them. Be mindfull of your eye movement as that flashes a white signal for hundreds of yards.

Saying this, I last took the kids out to watch a sett and we sat in the car in the middle of the field.

Hope you have a good evening.

Ogri the trog
 

Buckshot

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Jan 19, 2004
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Hmmm, interesting debate here and some very valid points. My take on it somewhere in the middle...
bambodoggy said:
...besides even if birds do see in colour they will be seeing colours all day...cars that they fly over, bluebells in the woods and other manmade and natural colour so one person wearing colour won't bother them....what will bother them is that person moving and as you can't watch the birds all the time they will see you moving...the best bet is just to move carefully and only when you really have too. It's the movement that will give you away...not your colour or cammo and that applies to the badgers and deer too :) .
Movement is the single biggest giveaway there's no doubt about it but, animals and birds where there is human contact are used to looking for the human siloete, regardless of whether movement is involved. Otherwise why was the traditional scarecrow used? They use the 'fear of man's siloete' that all wild animals (i'll include birds when I use that term from now on) have. So high contrasting (with the back ground) solid clothing will always create that shape. At this point you have raised the alertness of the animals in the area. By wearing some sort of dispruptive pattern the human shape is broken up and therefore makes stalking less difficult - not easy - just less difficult. By 'disruptive pattern' I don't mean only cammo, a check pattern works quite well for instance.
I know modern scarecrows don't look anything like a human and use movement as the deterant, which goes to prove that's what they look for mainly. Also any scarecrow only has a short working 'scare factor' life because animals get used to it. They notice when something is out of place, and you standing in a wood in white t-shirt is out of the norm.




bambodoggy said:
...Again for the above reasons Doc's hide idea is spot on...in a hide there is no movement and so it works really well. Hence I suggested an old blanket over you to watch the badgers...it's like a portable hide and will break up your shape.
There were tests done for decoying pigeons a while ago when they tested modern cammo patterns and some of the orange plastic square mesh that used to be put round holes in the ground. There was absolutely no difference in the results !

Great link Chris, for exactIy the reasons in that link I prefer large bold patterns as cammo. I was out shooting several years ago and a mate walked down a hedge about 200m away. He was wearing a posh (read expensive) realtree coat and stood out like a sore thumb. It just looked like a large grey mass, even through the binos. That taught me alot!
If I could afford the WW2 para smock copy that's made now I'd get one, that's got a large pattern.

I'm sure I've forgotten another line of thought as well, but there you go....

Cheers

Mark
 

bambodoggy

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Nov 10, 2004
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As I said, it's movement and breaking up your shape that are important..not colour..... so sitting still under a blanket that breaks your shape is ideal.. :cool:

Off camping at the end of the week..... happy days! :D
 

ChrisKavanaugh

Need to contact Admin...
I was attending the local college and working part time in the citrus orchard ( college started as an agricultural center when California still produced food instead of celebrities.) As a lark I glued big orange circles on Olive drab overalls. President Reagan came to speak. My boss was this Tom Bombadill bearded hippie and had assembled a large flock of geese and ducks. All of a sudden two Men In Black with sunglasses, walkie talkies and prominent bulges under their jackets ordered him out for security. He replied he had to secure the flock. I was up a tree repairing a wound and the beehives were close by. The Secret Service saw the bees, never looked closer and I remained " a clear and present danger." There in the rare moment of utter privacy and peace of an orchard surrounded by freeway noise and the squawking loudspeaker " I hear you young people have a pretty good FOOTBALL TEAM." I saw it, or rather it had been staring at me- a beautifull and rarely seen weasel hunting bird eggs. :D
 

arctic hobo

Native
Oct 7, 2004
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I find a big giveaway is when you point or look at them... being a photographer I often find animals are more shy with a big lens (or a gun either I imagine) being pointed at them, and you'll get more shots if you only turn at the last minute. The same goes for looking, you can get a lot closer if you aren't looking at the animal, DPM or no, as I guess it doesn't see you as a threat. After all, peacocks have pretend eyes to scare away other animals.
 

arctic hobo

Native
Oct 7, 2004
1,630
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Devon *sigh*
www.dyrhaug.co.uk
Oh, and spot the man in this shot:
433372-38226-46014_resized.jpg


Good old Fjellduken :D
 

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