Bushcraft shelters in winter - no tent/sleeping bag

[Kav]

The original inhabitants of Tierra del Fuego survived cold nights by bunching closely. Herd animals do this.
Unless you are a herd of Guernsey cows kidnapped to TdF
People in cold climes all have a ready made shelter, or the skill to build one IE Inuit Igloo.

 

[Tengu]

Yes, but they did not have clothes and were acclimatised to the cold.

 

[n00b]

So, the moral of this is not to get caught outside without a sleeping bag and tent in GB winters?

The moral is we can, we've just been weakened by convenience

 

[Nic 1084]

on a few occasions, being a wildfowl, I used to shoot over a harbour area in Dorset. I would go out in the evening, shoot the dusk flight then sleep on the open boat to shoot the dawn flight before catching the tide to get back. Usually I utilised a bivvy bag or one piece good quality waterproofs. even with good layers and decent kit, the damp is what gets to you. after that the cold and the wind. if you can negate this then its ok. back in my military days I have had to sleep in minimal kit (E & E exercises) in snow and ice in Jan/Feb and I can honestly say that sleep was not something that came easily as it was 'kin cold with no kit

 

[1 pot hunter]

Hi - has anyone slept without a sleeping bag and tent in winter (UK), just using what's naturally available for warmth and shelter? In addition to a decent set of clothes - or not! Curious to know what gear is actually 100% necessary in other people's experience.
Cheers

The best in my experience is a very small debris hut insulated to your armpits on outside with leaves make it tiny n low to the ground to trap body heat stuff inside n plug up entrance when u sleep Iff your making a shelter ,with no gear or fire small is beautifull always.

 

[Barney Rubble]

Hi - has anyone slept without a sleeping bag and tent in winter (UK), just using what's naturally available for warmth and shelter? In addition to a decent set of clothes - or not! Curious to know what gear is actually 100% necessary in other people's experience.
Cheers

As per the previous comments, it can be done. But you need to be prepared to put a lot of work in to build the shelter and gather enough firewood to get you through the night.

Personally, I'm not always that keen on building shelters owing to the golden rule of leave no trace and the sad reality of having to dismantle the shelter that I would have toiled over for several hours.

I have a woodland permission, but I am asked to be discreet when camping. To that end, I think a good compromise is to camp with natural fibres such as a canvas tarp or poncho and wool bedding. The advantage here is the product's natural resistance to sparks meaning that you can have a fire relatively close by. This compromise also affords you the time to collect enough fire wood and practice a few other skills such as fire lighting and woodcraft (challenge yourself by leaving your tinder pouch and spoon at home?).

I've enjoyed a few camps in this way and have found them to be comfortable, notwithstanding the broken nights sleep as you re-stock the fire. Using this method you can also dispatch with the wool bedding and rely on your clothing and a raised bed or debris bed. The debris beds are surprisingly effective and comfortable (kind of like natures memory foam!).

 

[Erbswurst]

What you can also take is an original plain green German army poncho that you usually can get used for approximately 30 € in fair condition.

It's rather heavy at approximately 800g depending on maker and production year but it is a bit fire retardant compared to other plastic fabric shelters.

It is quite durable and because it can be used as ground sheet, bivvy bag, lean to shelter or rain coat a sensible part of a serious no nonsense survival training kit.

I find it quite interesting to spend the time outdoors with a strictly limited amount of items instead of the nowadays usual modern all comfort equipment.

Nothing against natural shelter building, but to be honest, you will take with you some raingear anyway, isn't it?

 

[TLM]

I think one would have to make a distinction between minimal and emergency shelters.

In the military they somewhat do tend to overlap though.

 

[n00b]

Maybe being nocturnal for the winter would be a good idea. Active at night and sleep in the relative warmth of the day.

Personally, I'm not always that keen on building shelters owing to the golden rule of leave no trace and the sad reality of having to dismantle the shelter that I would have toiled over for several hours.

I think if it's a shelter built using natural materials then leaving it up is fine. I like coming across shelters like this in the woods. Fair enough if you have an agreement not to with one particular landowner, but wild camping generally I would have no problem leaving primitive shelters up.

 

[Broch]

I think if it's a shelter built using natural materials then leaving it up is fine. I like coming across shelters like this in the woods. Fair enough if you have an agreement not to with one particular landowner, but wild camping generally I would have no problem leaving primitive shelters up.

On this crowded little island, with few wild spaces, we'll have to agree to disagree

 

[Ozmundo]

I was stuck out many years ago. No gear and no idea of how far habitation was. Essentially I did not sleep. The ground was frozen as it had snowed, thawed (soaked through the leaf litter) and then frozen again. If it had rained I think it would have finished me off. I just sort shelter from the wind, I was unable to start a fire. A cat appeared and I got it to approach me at which point I shoved it inside my jumper until the morning. I kid you not.

I’d take a charged head torch over a survival tin if there was any chance of being out after dark.

You can make a hat out of boxers if you have no other head covering.

Bloody miserable exercise that I do everything to avoid.

 

[n00b]

A cat appeared and I got it to approach me at which point I shoved it inside my jumper until the morning.

That cat must have liked you. Maybe it was the boxers on your head.

On this crowded little island, with few wild spaces, we'll have to agree to disagree

Fair enough but I'm curious to know what damage you think it does. Is it just an aesthetic preference?

 

[Ozmundo]

I don’t have a definite opinion on it but I can see arguments for and against primitive shelters as a matter of course.

Gathering and using natural materials is probably more disturbing to a site than putting down a bivi bag.

Is a well managed open fire worse for the site than a jetboil rocketing away?

I think that behaviour of the user makes the difference.

In my previous post I forgot to add I did build the most simple of shelters. I kicked anything available into a pile to extend the cover from a bush. I’m honestly not sure it made any difference, maybe the activity helped. When you are young you bounce more!

To this day I camp with a cat.



He wants a second portion. When I acquired him I got a wife thrown in as part of the package.

 

[Tengu]

You were lucky to find a compliant cat?

(Maybe they were lost and cold)

 

[Pattree]

Gathering and using natural materials is probably more disturbing to a site than putting down a bivi bag.

Is a well managed open fire worse for the site than a jetboil rocketing away?

I think that behaviour of the user makes the difference.

This ^^^^^^^^^. In spades.



Edited to add:

On this tiny island, if you’re caught out at night and the terrain is safe - just keep walking till you find shelter or help (or the help you phoned finds you.)

If you are really totally disorientated and you really don’t have a compass and you really don’t know the landscape: pick a star and keep walking - yes yes, you’ll walk in a gentle curve but it will be daylight soon.

 

[n00b]

Gathering and using natural materials is probably more disturbing to a site than putting down a bivi bag.

Is a well managed open fire worse for the site than a jetboil rocketing away?

Building the shelter of course disturbs local wildlife, but so does being there at all. Dismantling it after use disturbs the wildlife a second time. I'm thinking of the insects that will have settled in it overnight. As for natural shelter vs bivi, when we're thinking ecologically we can't ignore the industry and infrastructure that goes into a mass-produced bivi. It may be less of a disturbance than raking up leaves but only very locally. More of a disturbance globally. Camp fires, well I'm sure the wildlife would prefer we didn't. But there are lots of things wildlife does that we'd prefer they didn't. I like to leave shelters intact for others to see, especially kids. What reason is there to care about the wild if we don't feel a part of it? To me 'leave no trace' (meaning no trace visible to us, and us alone) only serves to reinforce our separateness from the wild, which does nothing to protect it in the long run, only dooms it to further mistreatment.

 

[n00b]

That's a beautiful cat btw! Not the one you stuffed up your jumper?

 

[Ozmundo]

Unfortunately not the original, too many decades ago.
He is very old, not sure exactly, and somewhat pernickety! He does like to sleep in a tent though.
Previously I had a pair of moggies that would sleep in the bag with you given any sort of chance. One by my feet and one around the neck, must have bumped the rating up by a season.
Probably not a reliable tool for survival situations however!

 

[n00b]

Camping with cats, nice. Not heard of that before.

 

[Erbswurst]

Well, I have up to 5 cats in my construction trailer if it gets cold. The downside is only that my bed has exactly the size of a large insulation mat and all of them are in there.



I think if you let the natural shelter standing around it might become interesting for some animals. A hedgehog for example, some insects, whatever. After it broke down surely mice or birds too.

The idea to leave no trace is really weird.
Was it created by the Montgolfier brothers or what?