Best knife steel
- Thread starter Chip Dale
- Start date
-
Come along to the amazing Summer Moot (21st July - 2nd August), a festival of bushcrafting and camping in a beautiful woodland PLEASE CLICK HERE for more information.
There is no easy answer to that question because firstly, "best" is often a subjective determination and secondly, it depends on how you plan to use the knife and what the geometry of the knife is. If you care to provide more details on how it will be used, maybe someone can suggests some good types of steel for the application. From your post and reference to a blacksmith, I assume you will want steel that makes a good forged knife, eh?
http://www.agrussell.com/knife_information/steel_guide/index.html
Many knives use a special steel that can be very difficult to sharpen.
In my opinion it's better to have a knife which you can resharpen instead of one which holds its edge a little bit longer but can be impossible to get sharp when you are in the bush!
This is the knife I'm using currently:
http://www.canit.se/~griffon/knives/m95/sissipuukko_m95.html
and the shape of the knife is very optimal. (When I'm hunting I use other knives).
Many knives use a special steel that can be very difficult to sharpen.
In my opinion it's better to have a knife which you can resharpen instead of one which holds its edge a little bit longer but can be impossible to get sharp when you are in the bush!
This is the knife I'm using currently:
http://www.canit.se/~griffon/knives/m95/sissipuukko_m95.html
and the shape of the knife is very optimal. (When I'm hunting I use other knives).
I think that if you have chosen a blacksmith, then the best thing to do would be to discuss the steel choices with the smith. A steel that the smith has used, likes using, recommends using, is going to be a better choice than some steel that the smith has no experiece with. The same is true in knife design.
There are really tons of steels, but the makers experience is probably far more important than the choice of steel formula.
There are really tons of steels, but the makers experience is probably far more important than the choice of steel formula.
Oh... this is a knife steel discussion... I was lookng for bait and heard someone opened a can of worms...
I would go with your smiths recommendation as well. The "best" steel will not be the "best" if he doesn't treat it right. Mac
I would go with your smiths recommendation as well. The "best" steel will not be the "best" if he doesn't treat it right. Mac
i think this question comes down to a few factors..
1: how good your sharpening skills are
2: how often you can be bothered to sharpen (and to do it well)
3: if you need you knife to be SUPER sharp all the time!!!
???????????
1: how good your sharpening skills are
2: how often you can be bothered to sharpen (and to do it well)
3: if you need you knife to be SUPER sharp all the time!!!
???????????
What Schwert & Pict said.
I can easily get O1 & silver steel, so I use those in general. 5160 or equivalent is nice to work with, I just prefer O1. I've got some 52100, I just haven't spent much time working with it yet. People asking me to forge D2 will get a rude answer until I have a power hammer....
I can easily get O1 & silver steel, so I use those in general. 5160 or equivalent is nice to work with, I just prefer O1. I've got some 52100, I just haven't spent much time working with it yet. People asking me to forge D2 will get a rude answer until I have a power hammer....
Cheers for the advice guys.
I did not explain my enquiry fully, so Ill try again. The knife I would like to have made would be used mainly for carving, but needs to be able to be used for general purpose work as well.
I was hoping to have a pair drop point; the upper most part of the edge would need to be quite fine to carry out close carving work. While the end part of the edge towards the choil would need to be quite thick to enable the knife to be used to split wood under downwards pressure.
Finally I hope to have a back which is the thickest part, to form a platform to allow it to be struck by a log to assert more pressure if needed.
The black smith gave me all these suggestions for types of steel to use, however he is good at his job, but I suspect that he, like me, has no real knowledge on how to use a knife to its maximum efficacy.
Any suggestions?
I did not explain my enquiry fully, so Ill try again. The knife I would like to have made would be used mainly for carving, but needs to be able to be used for general purpose work as well.
I was hoping to have a pair drop point; the upper most part of the edge would need to be quite fine to carry out close carving work. While the end part of the edge towards the choil would need to be quite thick to enable the knife to be used to split wood under downwards pressure.
Finally I hope to have a back which is the thickest part, to form a platform to allow it to be struck by a log to assert more pressure if needed.
The black smith gave me all these suggestions for types of steel to use, however he is good at his job, but I suspect that he, like me, has no real knowledge on how to use a knife to its maximum efficacy.
Any suggestions?
Maybe you should have a trawl through the thread on BB.
http://www.britishblades.com/forums/index.php
These are the knife nuts as opposed to us mudboys as they call us!
http://www.britishblades.com/forums/index.php
These are the knife nuts as opposed to us mudboys as they call us!
Chip Dale said:
WHEN I WAS IN THE ARMY A KNIFE WAS FOR STICKING ON THE END OF A SLR AND FOR KILLING PEOPLE!
Sometime the best ideas are the simplist.Seriously though, if you are looking for a design to meet specific needs look at tools that have worked for many generation - I am having a knife custom made for bushcraft and I have taken the best features of all the best bushcraft knives, plus the likes and dislikes of leading figures (Mors Kochanski mainly) and amalgimated them into one knife which I hope will finally be THE KNIFE!
I'd be interested to see this chopper your planning once you get off the drawing board.
Chip Dale said:
OK... A lot of this is purely down to personal preference.
As a general rule, for larger blades you want a slightly lower carbon steel for the shock resistance, as they usually need to be a bit springier. For stuff 6-8" or less, high carbon (around 1%) is great. Doesn't mean you can't make a good knife with .7%, it'll just keep its edge a bit better (and be more difficult to sharpen).
Many of the knives sold as bushcraft use O1, although they are frequently ground from flat stock rather than forged.
I'd still try and find out what his preference is...
Chip,
Here's my two penny-worth:
Of the carbon steels suitable for forging these split down into carbon steels and tool steels. Any of the following make a good knife blade: 01; 06; W1; W2; 1045 and 1095; 5160; A2 and D2.
As has been mentioned elsewhere the make up of D2 makes this steel a pig to forge. I have bushcraft blades made from W1 and 1095 and these are relatively easy to sharpen but they also hold a good edge. You will strugle to find a stainless steel suitable for forging for the same reason as D2.
The secret to knife blade performance is heat treatment. A skilled smith should be able to differentially heat treat a blade to allow the edge to be hard but the back to be softer allowing you to pound away with a baton.
Hope this helps.
Regards
Tack
Here's my two penny-worth:
Of the carbon steels suitable for forging these split down into carbon steels and tool steels. Any of the following make a good knife blade: 01; 06; W1; W2; 1045 and 1095; 5160; A2 and D2.
As has been mentioned elsewhere the make up of D2 makes this steel a pig to forge. I have bushcraft blades made from W1 and 1095 and these are relatively easy to sharpen but they also hold a good edge. You will strugle to find a stainless steel suitable for forging for the same reason as D2.
The secret to knife blade performance is heat treatment. A skilled smith should be able to differentially heat treat a blade to allow the edge to be hard but the back to be softer allowing you to pound away with a baton.
Hope this helps.
Regards
Tack
There are many great steels for a feild knife. Remember however that the heat treat is far more important than the steel.
You can take a steel like 12C27 and heat treat it so it holds an edge like O1 or better and yet is easy to sharpen. Rust resistance is superb. However this requires a very very complex and precise treat that few makers can do or can be bothered to do. On papaer 12C27 is similar to 6a or 440a steel and those are not very good steels for edge holding.
Take a very good steel like A2 or S30V and give it a poor heat treat and its rubbish.
For a feild knife, I tend to prefer a good carbon steel like O1, 1095 or A2 steel. Tough and easy to sharpen. Its nice to have in a larger knife especially, though in smaller blades, say 5" or less, I tend to prefer a stainless laminate or Damasteel blade as well as S30V or VG-10.
I would go with O1 or A2 steel if I were you based upon your criteria.
You can take a steel like 12C27 and heat treat it so it holds an edge like O1 or better and yet is easy to sharpen. Rust resistance is superb. However this requires a very very complex and precise treat that few makers can do or can be bothered to do. On papaer 12C27 is similar to 6a or 440a steel and those are not very good steels for edge holding.
Take a very good steel like A2 or S30V and give it a poor heat treat and its rubbish.
For a feild knife, I tend to prefer a good carbon steel like O1, 1095 or A2 steel. Tough and easy to sharpen. Its nice to have in a larger knife especially, though in smaller blades, say 5" or less, I tend to prefer a stainless laminate or Damasteel blade as well as S30V or VG-10.
I would go with O1 or A2 steel if I were you based upon your criteria.
Use O1, its widely avaiable in many convient sizes in the UK, its inexpensive, its easy to forge so I'm been informed, its been used for making forged knives for years by smiths of all skill levels and it makes a knife with a combination of good edge holding and toughness. It can be heat treated by someone with a little experience and knowledge.
Its difficult to get some of the steels commonly used by American smiths in small quantities in this country so I think O1 is your best bet.
Its difficult to get some of the steels commonly used by American smiths in small quantities in this country so I think O1 is your best bet.
