EdS
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
other thing is the law requires is that trap entrace must have a circumferance of less than 9cm to prevent otters gettig caught
crayfish pics
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Why do you need a licence when you are doing the conservation of our british wildlife a favour by getting rid of foreign species who are detriment to out own native species ? I would have thought the powers that be would have welcomed you with open arms ??
I'll be happy to do it - but only with a licence and when I understand otter guards and the like (and clearly also with landowners permission).
Part of that is ensuring that I don't unintentionally harm other creatures through action / inaction and part is that following the law is vital to me as an FAC holder etc. The last thing I need is being hauled up in court for illegal trapping - bang would go my next renewal!
Red
<shrug> Just pointing out where I stand & what the law says. That was the point of the the original post. What you choose to do is clearly your choice. Me, I prefer to be "squeaky clean" as regards the law
Red
Red
Cammokid you owe British Red an apology.
There are enough troubles trying to get access to land and fishing in England without you posting on such an open forum.
BcUK cannot be seen to encourage or endorse illegal activity.
Please moderate your posts.
p.s. I've edited the thread accordingly, everyone's understanding in this matter would be appreciated.
Toddy
There are enough troubles trying to get access to land and fishing in England without you posting on such an open forum.
BcUK cannot be seen to encourage or endorse illegal activity.
Please moderate your posts.
p.s. I've edited the thread accordingly, everyone's understanding in this matter would be appreciated.
Toddy
EdS
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
just spoken to the EA -
you are unlikely to get a licence for the north of England as:
1) Many of the rivers still have a significant population of native white crayfish - these have increase slightly in resent years. I know this is true of the Dales - while they do have lots (and lots) of signal they are also the "strongholds" of native. The signal have trouble extendig up inot the faster flowing upper reaches. A number of the tributory rivers on the main Dales rivers have realtively high poulations of native and few if any signal
2) concerns about spreading crayfish fungus etc. See above
3) recent research has show that small scale isolated trapping increase signal crayfish populations - they are cannabalistic and trapping removes the bigger more aggressive crayfish.
Got the number of the local fisheries guy so I'm going to give him a ring to confirm some stuff.
you are unlikely to get a licence for the north of England as:
1) Many of the rivers still have a significant population of native white crayfish - these have increase slightly in resent years. I know this is true of the Dales - while they do have lots (and lots) of signal they are also the "strongholds" of native. The signal have trouble extendig up inot the faster flowing upper reaches. A number of the tributory rivers on the main Dales rivers have realtively high poulations of native and few if any signal
2) concerns about spreading crayfish fungus etc. See above
3) recent research has show that small scale isolated trapping increase signal crayfish populations - they are cannabalistic and trapping removes the bigger more aggressive crayfish.
Got the number of the local fisheries guy so I'm going to give him a ring to confirm some stuff.
EdS
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Actually it will go further as it will be the EA that are the enforcement authority, not the police - they will take it to court.
what a joke..ever made a fire some where you didnt have permision or picked a blackberry of a bush with out asking land owners permision what is wrong with people where do you think we all come from..hunter gather not licence and permisions its silly
Great thread as I've been wanting to look at this for ages but there is loads of conflicting information from multiple sources forums, official sites so I just phoned the EA and they put me through to the local person In my case the man who covers the lodden area - windsor, maidenhead right up to farnborough.
Its different rules for different areas - The southwest and parts of the north for example it may be more difficult but basically the porcess is this.
- Complete an FR2 form and you will get a free licence with a tag to identify your traps. This is like a rod licence and give you the ability to use a trap but not the right to trap in a particular location (like a rod licence)
http://www.efishbusiness.co.uk/formsandguides/FR2Notes705.pdf
http://www.efishbusiness.co.uk/formsandguides/fr2.pdf
- You then need to seek permission from the land owner/fishing rights for the water e.g basingstoke canal - The bstoke canal authority - national trust etc.
- set your trap, catch some crayfish, flush in cold bucket of clean water for 24 hours, dispatch and cook, Job Done!!!
I'm off to fill out the form and by a trap.
Dan
Its different rules for different areas - The southwest and parts of the north for example it may be more difficult but basically the porcess is this.
- Complete an FR2 form and you will get a free licence with a tag to identify your traps. This is like a rod licence and give you the ability to use a trap but not the right to trap in a particular location (like a rod licence)
http://www.efishbusiness.co.uk/formsandguides/FR2Notes705.pdf
http://www.efishbusiness.co.uk/formsandguides/fr2.pdf
- You then need to seek permission from the land owner/fishing rights for the water e.g basingstoke canal - The bstoke canal authority - national trust etc.
- set your trap, catch some crayfish, flush in cold bucket of clean water for 24 hours, dispatch and cook, Job Done!!!
I'm off to fill out the form and by a trap.
Dan
This forum will not condone or promote illegal activity,
Quite apart from the legal issues, too many good people have a lot of trouble getting permission to access woodlands. Comments like yours stand out and are thrown in folks faces as justification for refusal.
Do not advocate illegal activity on this site.
Toddy
Only because I've edited the thread.
You are very new here.
Please go and read the rules.
We have very few, but we adhere to them and hope they make life easier for everybody.
Toddy
You are very new here.
Please go and read the rules.
We have very few, but we adhere to them and hope they make life easier for everybody.
Toddy
I just wonder if its worth pointing out that lots of people have done things in good faith, not nessesairily knowing the full extent of reasons behind why some things are required.
Im not suggesting anyone specific or anyone on here but i do know of areas where signals have been introduced into pristine white claw habitat by people that should have known better (bushcrafters, as foraging locations, same for pluage spreading.
I just think if in areas where there is no big deal its easy to get a licence why not go for it you might even learn something in the process? Where it is less straight forwards theer are probably reasons.
The legislation is quite complex with several bylaws specific to crayfish, which im not going to go into here. As well as other laws which you could be 'got' for. It is true however that legal action seems to be undertaken infrequently, which is the same with almost all wildlife legislation.
Also a good comment about otter guards, there are not many traps that can be bought that dont need modifying to fit the legislation on this point. But, water voles can get trapped in them too - the water vole safety ones unfortunately dont work not to mention water shrews, so awareness of other species is important too.
I think people get quite defensive about white claws (myself included) since its a species that is likely to go extinct (with the exception of safe 'Ark' sites) within our lifetimes and can be affected in large areas by such trivial things as fording a river if you have been in pluaged waters - and there is no way of knowing where they are, although a lot of monitoring does happen in some areas.
It'd be nice if it was simple wouldnt it - i have to say i do fancy signal, being in east anglia licences should be easy for the area too.
Im not suggesting anyone specific or anyone on here but i do know of areas where signals have been introduced into pristine white claw habitat by people that should have known better (bushcrafters, as foraging locations, same for pluage spreading.
I just think if in areas where there is no big deal its easy to get a licence why not go for it you might even learn something in the process? Where it is less straight forwards theer are probably reasons.
The legislation is quite complex with several bylaws specific to crayfish, which im not going to go into here. As well as other laws which you could be 'got' for. It is true however that legal action seems to be undertaken infrequently, which is the same with almost all wildlife legislation.
Also a good comment about otter guards, there are not many traps that can be bought that dont need modifying to fit the legislation on this point. But, water voles can get trapped in them too - the water vole safety ones unfortunately dont work not to mention water shrews, so awareness of other species is important too.
I think people get quite defensive about white claws (myself included) since its a species that is likely to go extinct (with the exception of safe 'Ark' sites) within our lifetimes and can be affected in large areas by such trivial things as fording a river if you have been in pluaged waters - and there is no way of knowing where they are, although a lot of monitoring does happen in some areas.
It'd be nice if it was simple wouldnt it - i have to say i do fancy signal, being in east anglia licences should be easy for the area too.
This is a great thread 
an ex mentioned crayfish trapping in france as a kid, but we never got around to trying it here due to lack of knowledge on the subject. I'm with Red on the "squeaky clean" thing, My Dad is ex services and I was bought up with a healthy respect for Authority
Also as far as land owners permission etc. I just figure it's respectful, if I found someone I didn't know on my land doing something with potentially harmful environmental consequenses, I'd not be too happy...
As I said though, great thread for motivating me to get on and sort it out! Thanks for all the helpful info guys
an ex mentioned crayfish trapping in france as a kid, but we never got around to trying it here due to lack of knowledge on the subject. I'm with Red on the "squeaky clean" thing, My Dad is ex services and I was bought up with a healthy respect for Authority Also as far as land owners permission etc. I just figure it's respectful, if I found someone I didn't know on my land doing something with potentially harmful environmental consequenses, I'd not be too happy...
As I said though, great thread for motivating me to get on and sort it out! Thanks for all the helpful info guys
I got all of the info just before moving back to UK but didn't go any further with it. I may have to find an infected area and see about getting a permission on there.
This one always kind of confused me....they say that if you take out the big ones the little ones thrive and spread since the beasties are cannibalistic...........why don't the native ones then get in there and eat the little signal ones too ? 
cheers,
Toddy
cheers,
Toddy
Toddy,
The natives are not anywhere near as aggresive, also in many areas signals (but not all) carry crayfish pluage, which they dont have the same reaction to as our natives. Unfortunately our white claws are from the delicate end of the crayfish spectrum.
Where the two do exist trapping doesnt seem to have helped the natives although i think the argument about the larger males eating young is only part of the story and suspect there is something about the absence of chemical stimulii making more females produce more eggs... although im not 100%m about that bit.
The post code system can be found on the application form here;
http://www.defra.gov.uk/corporate/regulat/forms/fish/cray2.pdf
The natives are not anywhere near as aggresive, also in many areas signals (but not all) carry crayfish pluage, which they dont have the same reaction to as our natives. Unfortunately our white claws are from the delicate end of the crayfish spectrum.
Where the two do exist trapping doesnt seem to have helped the natives although i think the argument about the larger males eating young is only part of the story and suspect there is something about the absence of chemical stimulii making more females produce more eggs... although im not 100%m about that bit.
The post code system can be found on the application form here;
http://www.defra.gov.uk/corporate/regulat/forms/fish/cray2.pdf
This one always kind of confused me....they say that if you take out the big ones the little ones thrive and spread since the beasties are cannibalistic...........why don't the native ones then get in there and eat the little signal ones too ?
cheers,
Toddy
The native ones may well do but there are far to few of them to make a difference. from what I can gather once the signals are in and area the poor little whiteclaws are screwed whatever we try and do. Its the disease the signals carry that do the damage. Catching and eating the signals does nothing other than revenge for the native population
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