Wood for burning.

[Buntybunny]

Hi all, just been reading some of your great post, so pleased to be in such an interesting group. Hope you can help.

Came back from visiting my daughter in Oz, she uses a wood burning stove in winter, had a great time in the outback collecting wood. Bought a wood burning stove when I got home and been trying it out for about 3 weeks.

Fortunately, I am spoiled for choice on wood, live in the wilds of Suffolk. Recently I experience excessive creosote deposits in my stove and excessive smoke coming into the room when I put wood in the stove.

Could this be the wood I am using? Had been using mostly oak and any hard wood, finding this burnt very slowly and didn't give off much heat, I went on to use softer woods. In Oz we collected some very heavy wood root that burnt well for a long time - nothing like that here lol!

Should I be looking at some other reason. Have read some very good post on ventilation - house like a wind tunnel know! lol. Measured the flue, checked the wind directions and cleaned the stove out well.

Any help or ideas very welcome!

Cheers B.

 

[Peter_t]

tbh prety much any wood burns but some are better than others. ash is the best, alder and elm dont burn that well but they still burn! some people are very fussy and ignorant, for example i know a forester that was selling some sycamoor logs and the customer said 'oh no that isnt that cr@py sycamoor stuf is it?' which he replied 'na its maple,' (sycamoor is a type of maple) and the customer didnt notice any difference.
at the end of the day it doesnt reely matter what you burn, dont refuse any 'rubbishy soft wood' etc. it just wont burn quite as well or as clean. but if you want to look out for better wood the best woods are probably ash, beech and hornbeam, they all burn well for a resonable time. birch burns very hot but is short lived so is ideal for starting the fire.

hope this helps

pete

 

[Ogri the trog]

Hi BB,
there are so many factors that govern creosote deposits that it is sometimes hard to comprehend - I certainly don't understand it all.
Yes the wood can have an effect but so does the stove and flue itself.
The creosote in the stove and flue are similar to condensation from a kettle on a cold window - it you can keep the burnt gasses hot and moving fast enough, they wont deposit the tar - hence thte stove needs to burn hot with sufficient air flow - which further means the need to get rid of the burnt gas, meaning a lined, small bore flue to keep it all moving. But it all has to conform to building regs so ask the advice of someone more qualified than me.
That and ensuring the wood is as dry as you can get it should help with your deposits but I'm not going to guarantee anything.

ATB

Ogri the trog

 

[squantrill]

My advice being born and bred in suffolk is .. don't use peoples fences or garden sheds in suffolk if they don't colour it with pigs blood then they will slap creosote on anything that looks like a tree!

but to be serious I assume your using seasoned wood rather than wet wood?? if you pick up wood thats dead on the ground it may have a type of tar from the decaying wood. Try burning really dry seasoned wood and see if it makes a differnce (buy some from a shop to try) if that solves the problem then you need to dry out your wood mine drys for almost a year before <i use it although the last batch burns nicely and thats only beeing lying for about 4 months

Simon

 

[Mike Ameling]

Lots of possibilities.

Creosote builds up when the smoke going up the chimney cools enough. The faster it cools, the more creosote builds up.

So how ... insulated ... is your chimney? If it is single wall iron pipe, then anything past 2 or 3 feet exposed outside will build up creosote fast.

And you can only get so much heat out of any wood. If you try to spread that heat out over too long of a period of time, you will be half-smothering your fire. That creates lots of extra smoke, and really cuts back on the heat. So less heat going up the chimney combined with more smoke means a lot more creosote.

And "wet" wood will also burn slower, with less heat and more smoke - leading to more creosote. Oak wood should burn well - if it is dry and you don't try to smother it too much to try and "conserve" the heat. Plus, too many people try to hold the fire all night long. To do this they ... smother ... the fire too much. If the fire burns down and it gets cold in the middle of the night, just get up and add more wood.

Dry softer wood (like boxelder, poppler, cottonwood, walnut) burn fast/hot, but don't last long. Fact of life. Just deal with it. They are great for starting the fire and for some quick heat. But you need those hardwoods to build up longer lasting coals/heat - like oak, maple, hickory. I use cut/split up old barn boards for kindling to get my fires started and perked up. 50+ years of weather exposure on the old barn really dried them out.

I have cut up oak trees for firewood that have been dead for over 20 years - and they were still WET inside when I split them. And those trees were not lying on the ground, but still standing! Oak just dries/seasons slowly. 1 to 2 inches a year - from any exposed surface. And any bark left on will hold that moisture in! Some of the oak I cut up had the sap-wood completely rotted away - leaving only the heartwood solid. That bark held the moisture in - even after many years of being dead or cut down. Plus trees also seems to draw and hold whatever moisture it can - from rain or even up from the ground.

Smoke coming back into your room when you open the door on the stove could be several reasons also. First is that creosote buildup. The more it builds up, the more it cuts down on the "draft" up the chimney. Less draft means the smoke isn't being "pulled" up the chimney, and will find another outlet - like out the door of your woodstove. When I feed my wood stove, I tend to open the door just a bit, and then wait a moment of two for the draft/fire to get flowing up the chimney a little better. Then I open the door all the way and feed it. But it also could mean that your chimney isn't tall enough in comparison to your roof, nearby buildings, and any trees in the area. These all cause airflow problems around your chimney. It is recommended that your chimney be at least 2 feet higher than the highest object nearby - like your house roof. Otherwise air flowing over that roof could then start heading down your chimney - or causing the "draft" to be inconsistent.

So, a few simple tips:
DRY wood - well seasoned - oak dries around two inches a year from an exposed surface
Burn your stove HOT - don't "smother" your fire
Pine wood has natural creosote in it, and must be burnt HOT or you will get excessive buildup of creosote
Any iron pipe longer than 2 or 3 feet and exposed outside needs to be insulated (double or triple wall)
Clean chimney - any obstruction or buildup of creosote will cut down on the draft

If you really need to have some coals left in the morning to use to start the fire back up, then leave a little more of the ashes in the stove. Those ashes will help insulate some coals for the next fire. And the more bark you burn, the faster you get more ashes.

Just a few humble thoughts to share. Take them as such.

Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands

 

[spoony]

Hi all, just been reading some of your great post, so pleased to be in such an interesting group. Hope you can help.

Came back from visiting my daughter in Oz, she uses a wood burning stove in winter, had a great time in the outback collecting wood. Bought a wood burning stove when I got home and been trying it out for about 3 weeks.

Fortunately, I am spoiled for choice on wood, live in the wilds of Suffolk. Recently I experience excessive creosote deposits in my stove and excessive smoke coming into the room when I put wood in the stove.

Could this be the wood I am using? Had been using mostly oak and any hard wood, finding this burnt very slowly and didn't give off much heat, I went on to use softer woods. In Oz we collected some very heavy wood root that burnt well for a long time - nothing like that here lol!

Should I be looking at some other reason. Have read some very good post on ventilation - house like a wind tunnel know! lol. Measured the flue, checked the wind directions and cleaned the stove out well.

Any help or ideas very welcome!

Cheers B.

heres a poem about woods to burn (not by me)

Beech wood fires are bright and clear
If the logs are kept a year.
Chestnuts only good, they say
If for long its laid away.
But ash wood new or ash wood old
Is fit for a queen with a crown of gold.
Birch and fir logs burn too fast,
Blaze up bright and do not last.
Is by the Irish said
Hawthorn bakes the sweetest bread.
Elm wood burns like churchyard mould -
Even the very flames are cold;
But ash wood green and ash wood brown
Is fit for a queen with a golden crown.
Poplar gives a bitter smoke,
Fills your eyes and makes you choke.
Apple wood will scent your room
With an incense like perfume.
Oaken logs if dry and old
Keep away the winter cold.
But ash wood wet and ash wood dry
A king shall warm his slippers by.

Oak logs will warm you well,
If they're warm and dry.
Larch logs of pine wood smell
But sparks will fly.
Beech logs for Christmas time;
Yew logs heat well.
Scotch logs its a crime
For anyone to sell.
Birch logs will burn too fast,
Chestnut scarce at all.
Hawthorn logs are good to last,
If cut in the fall.
Holly logs will burn like wax,
You should burn them green.
Elm logs like smouldering flax;
No flames to be seen.
Pear logs and apple logs,
They will scent your room.
Cherry logs across the dogs
Smell like flowers in bloom.
But ash logs all smooth and gray,
Burn them green or old,
Buy up all that come you way,
They're worth their weight in gold

 

[robin wood]

"So, a few simple tips:
DRY wood - well seasoned - oak dries around two inches a year from an exposed surface
Burn your stove HOT - don't "smother" your fire
Pine wood has natural creosote in it, and must be burnt HOT or you will get excessive buildup of creosote
Any iron pipe longer than 2 or 3 feet and exposed outside needs to be insulated (double or triple wall)
Clean chimney - any obstruction or buildup of creosote will cut down on the draft"

This pretty well covers it. I suspect your problem is either wet wood (as in not properly seasoned, not just wet on the outside) and or not burning the fire up enough. You don't have to burn it flat out all the time but it is bad news to burn it closed down all the time. As a rule I close it down overnight to keep the fire in but at least once every couple of days I really roar it up, by that I mean fill it with good dry wood, open all the inlets and let it roar for 20 minutes, this gets the whole thing, stove and flue well hot, revapourizes all the crud that has collected over the last couple of days and blats it out the top of the chimney. I would strongly advise having your chimney swept before initiating this new regime as it sounds like ti is now well clogged (that is probably the source of your smoking problem. If you can see tar in the stove imagine how much more there is in the top 12" of the flue where everything gets cold and condenses out. I have seen flues gunked so that only 3" diameter hole was left open where it should be 8* that means you get less updraft and you fire smokes. If you want to check it yourself and have safe access to the chimney stack go up and look down from the top.

 

[burning]

Well that thread title really got my hopes up....... oh well

 

[swyn]

Greetings Buntybunny.

Lots of good info in this thread.

Heres my little offering;

All fires have what I call 'character'. This is just another way to describe how they operate. Your fire will have its own character depending on chimney flue dimensions, the wood burned and the air allowed to access the firebox. Size too. (just to keep things simple)

The ideal temperature to achieve is one that when you spit on it, the spit just sizzles, not rolls off! This will then mean the temperature is hot enough inside the firebox to be getting rid of excess moisture efficiently and not just going up the chimney as you do need to benefit from some of the heat produced.

A chimney liner has been mentioned in other replies. I am assuming this chimney is NOT lined, and this is a brick one and not metal. This in not such a problem for now as later. So I will not go down that route here.
I will say that it is important to get the chimney hot so it will draw properly and this takes a couple or four days! This will also help with stopping condensation, but as I have said I am not going down that way!

So to try and keep things simple;

Get the fire going well, leave the doors open for this... maybe even for a couple of hours to make sure. You will also need a good ash bed...this helps too!

Shut the doors leaving the vent open and get a good temperature up within the firebox.

Don't forget to keep feeding the wood in!

Gradually shut the air vent to achieve a good drying/combustion ratio (just like making charcoal) you may not have to shut right down, this just depends on the 'character'.

Tend occasionally now, twice or three times a day, depending on the size of the firebox, wood used....You will just get used to how the fire behaves. You may just find the chimney breast is starting to get warm. You are now achieving a successful temperature. Keep this up 'till April and you would have survived another winter in comfort!!!

Remember to empty some ash out as and when this is needed (once a week). Don't take it all out. This can be done if you have an ash pan or with a small shovel.

Hope this helps!

Swyn.

PS. Our Morso goes from Oct to April without missing a beat!

PPS I quite like the Highlander 3 & 5 stoves made by Dunsley heat (no connection, just a happy customer). So now have two 5's and one 3 fitted in the village. Efel have all but dissappeared.

 

[mr dazzler]

I live in suffolk too and a woodburner is our main heating source.
There is some excellent tips already posted. A flue can gum up very fast. The last lot of wood I bought from a "reputable dealer" was wet, and I thought oh its only 5 or 6 weeks until we need to stop using the stove...... But in that time the top end of the flue crudded up, the internal diameter was down to about 2 or 3 inches and the cowl was all gummed up too. I knew we had a serious problem when I tried to light up and we had jets of flame exiting from the air inlets when the smokey kindling ingited and caused a minor explosion The draw was non existent. The sweep (who had swept the flue 2 months before) had to use rods with a brass weight on the end to tap the cowl to loosen the tar. I no longer buy split firewood, I buy wood by the proper full cord (from Lopham Fen) in 4 foot lenghts and cross cut and split it myself. I know for certain what is dry and what isnt. What type of flue do you have? some people try to get away with an old gas fire flue Or try to use one with gaps in it, or no liner at all. A neighbours house burnt down last christmas due to combustion gases leaking out of the flue and igniting rafters and the thatch. Mine is compliant with current building regs, a continuous length of twin wall stainless steel, back filled with vermiculite for insulation to prevent condensation, proper fitted plate to seal the entrance of the flue above the stove, proper tight gaskets on the door etc, all cuts down on inefficiency. My Franco Belge lights every time and is usually spit hot in 10 to 12 minutes. It uses 1 to 1 1/2 cu feet of wood a day in winter. Actually I find birch to be a decent wood, it catches fast and produces hot embers but goes quickly, ash oak and hawthorn are good. But whatever you use must be dry, 20 % moisture content or better

 

[Ex Member - Sidney Bounty]

Here is how we deal with it over here in the morning fill your wood stove up full leave door open an inch till it catches fire again or relight then let it burn good and hot and fiercely for 20 min this heats up the stove pipe also burns off the creosote buildup from the last day its like a small chimney fire each morning then load stove up again if needed and shut door and dampners...you still have to clean the chimney very 3 or 6 or 12 months depending on how much you use it...

 

[wanderinstar]

I had this problem of tar. I lived in a bungalow and the tar was running down the chimmney pot. There is something you can get to burn the tar of. Can't remember what it is called. think it was in a bag that you just threw on the fire. Main cause of problem , unseasoned wood. This was all about 20 years ago. Am thinking about getting another one and this post has some very useful info in it.

 

[VirusKiller]

"Holly logs will burn like wax". What does this mean?! Sooty?