Robb Wolf hunting elk with a spear

Gagnrad

Forager
Jul 2, 2010
108
0
South East
From the programme "I Caveman".

He's also using a spearthrower (atatl as they say here -- or woomera out as the boys Down Under would say).

[video=youtube;BrHCpxoBcyU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrHCpxoBcyU[/video]
 
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shaggystu

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Nov 10, 2003
4,345
33
Derbyshire
that's one of the most distasteful pieces of entertainment i've ever seen, utterly disgusting
 

cbr6fs

Native
Mar 30, 2011
1,620
0
Athens, Greece
Fantastic bit of throwing and hunting that.

I have watched the entire episode and have to say with their lack of food and conditions there were living in i was surprised they could hit a barn door.

Was an interesting program and it certainly thinned out the whinging complaining jerks from those that had a pair.
 

Gagnrad

Forager
Jul 2, 2010
108
0
South East
Suffered a LOT less than if a bear had caught it ;)

Worse for any organism, as a professor of philosophy pointed out a few years back now, is to come to your end by means of something smaller than you:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Animal-Rights-Wrongs-Roger-Scruton/dp/0826494048/

If it's suffering that's the issue, then the animal got off light. An end in an instant while it's in the pride of its strength. Real pain would be a lingering death eaten out from within by parasites or microbes.

But, of course, it's not the animal's suffering that's really the issue, but the squeamishness of the viewers.

It's just the normal cycle of life. Anyone other than a modern suburbanite understands that. I shouldn't have posted the link, if I'd thought I would offend anyone. But I'd assumed that people coming to a sie called "Bushcraft" weren't lovers of the great indoors.
 

Perrari

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Feb 21, 2012
3,090
1
Eryri (Snowdonia)
www.erknives.com
Yes I know mate, but the bear wouldnt be making a TV programme he would have to do it to survive. These characters arent really starving, they have probably 50 film crew around them and tons of food. If that was the only thing they had to eat then fair enough, but I doubt that was the case.

Suffered a LOT less than if a bear had caught it ;)
 

bushwacker bob

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Sep 22, 2003
3,824
17
STRANGEUS PLACEUS
A hunt like that served the human population for its entire evolution up until the last millenium.(about 5 million years)
It is interesting that we now find our evolution distasteful. Faced with dispatching a large mammal like that, how else would you do it?
Go to Tesco's I guess is the correct answer.
 

cbr6fs

Native
Mar 30, 2011
1,620
0
Athens, Greece
Yes I know mate, but the bear wouldnt be making a TV programme he would have to do it to survive. These characters arent really starving, they have probably 50 film crew around them and tons of food. If that was the only thing they had to eat then fair enough, but I doubt that was the case.

it's not, it's doing it in the name of entertainment that's my issue


Problem here is that the clip is really taken out of context if you haven't watched the whole episode.

Sure it was filmed and televised, but there was a scientific background (admittedly weak) to the "experiment".
They were seeing if a modern human could adapt and survive if thrown back to basic tooled caveman hunter gatherers.

I say weak as obviously there are many many parts of the world were we as a species do, but this was swept over by focusing on a "modern" person adapting.

Sure there were doctors and no doubt food sitting there in standby, but it seemed from the program editing at least that they were genuinely hungry and had only eaten what they had hunted or gathered.
To the point where this whinging women walked off.


Personally i think it offered extremely thin scientific value, it wasn't even THAT entertaining, but still i think many on here would find it interesting enough to watch.

Morally to be honest i don't really care.
That may sound bad, but honestly i eat meat, so i have absolutely no idea if the cow, pig, sheep etc suffered in the abattoir before it died.
Having had a summer working in a abattoir as a kid, most folks would be disgusted how non-effective current killing methods are, and even if the methods are good, you can imagine that this is not that sort of job that attracts the most caring or professional of person (being very poorly paid).

Add to that the fact that although when i've hunted and fished i've made a concious attempt to reduce suffering and make a quick kill, i've still missed on occasion or foul hooked a fish, so for me to complain about the animal suffering is pretty hypocritical at best.
 

shaggystu

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Nov 10, 2003
4,345
33
Derbyshire
If it had been done as a living history experiment and you had read about it, it would be alright then?

that's a really good question. i think maybe experiment is the key point for me there, i think that it's more the parameters of the experiment or the context of the act (killing an elk with a spear) that i have issues with. i find it hard to believe that the elk that were hunted in this film were totally wild animals. firstly, managing to get multiple unskilled (as far as i'm aware) people within spear range of a herd of wild elk with an entire film crew looking on seams unlikely to me. secondly, having one of those people throw a spear and miss and then the wild elk show no real reaction seams unbelievable. i agree with your earlier comment about that type of hunt serving us well for a long time but i doubt that the average neolithic elk stood there shouting "go on, have another go". i looks to me very much like the elk in that film are utterly used to human interaction and don't see the "hunters" as a threat at all. if the parameters/context of the act were changed i wouldn't have a problem with it all

stuart
 

bushwacker bob

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Sep 22, 2003
3,824
17
STRANGEUS PLACEUS
Morally to be honest i don't really care.
That may sound bad, but honestly i eat meat, so i have absolutely no idea if the cow, pig, sheep etc suffered in the abattoir before it died.
Having had a summer working in a abattoir as a kid, most folks would be disgusted how non-effective current killing methods are, and even if the methods are good, you can imagine that this is not that sort of job that attracts the most caring or professional of person (being very poorly paid).

Add to that the fact that although when i've hunted and fished i've made a concious attempt to reduce suffering and make a quick kill, i've still missed on occasion or foul hooked a fish, so for me to complain about the animal suffering is pretty hypocritical at best.
He said what I was going to.:)
 

Perrari

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Feb 21, 2012
3,090
1
Eryri (Snowdonia)
www.erknives.com
Yes ok I may have jumped to conclusions. I would have no hesitation in killing the animal myself or eating it on a moral standing. And admittedly I havent seen the whole episode. But the clip I have seen is 'Big Brother' with fur! I do have some experience of working behind the scenes filming, and trust me what you see on TV is not always what whas actually filmed.
 

santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
16,909
1,120
68
Florida
I don't have a problem with the act of hunting (for whatever reason or with whatever weapon) but I too have a problem beleiving much of this wasn't staged. those elk are just too tame.
 

cbr6fs

Native
Mar 30, 2011
1,620
0
Athens, Greece
I dont see the point in the argument whatsoever.

Your dog wouldnt think that way, would he?

Honestly don't see any argument what-so-ever.

People have put forward the points they see relevant and their opinions, if folks stopped doing that then there would be no need for forums would there?


Could you please expand on your dog statement as well, as to me it wasn't very clear what point you were trying make.
 

calgarychef

Forager
May 19, 2011
168
1
woking
Having hunted elk I'm sure those were farmed animals, but it's still an accomplishment to kill something like that with an atlatl. I was chuffed for them and it provided a lot of meat for the group who were literally starving by the way. That's how we killed animals for 1000's of years and to see it done again is nothing short of fantastic. Watching animals die isn't easy though and as a very active hunter I still don't like to see things die but die they must before we eat them. It wasn't just for entertainment that would be killing something simply to kill it and not use it, this animal was butchered and used.
 

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