Our Malaysian fire piston

[bandel4]

Thanks to Bod for sharing 'fire piston' with us.
On a recent trip to an Orang Asli village, we got one made for us.
So, a few days ago, me and my misses sat down and made this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvZzTWej764

Cheers,
http://www.my-rainforest-adventures.com/

 

[Hammock_man]

How did a "primitive" people find out that these things work?

I am not underestimating the knowledge of these people, just the technology. I can see how having first made a simple bow, over 100's of years this gets transformed into a high tech life saver. Plant knowledge can be gathered one leaf at a time and passed down via an oral tradition.

But a fire piston needs to be almost perfect or they don’t work at all. I can see how I would get from a bicycle pump to a fire piston but ”I” still need the pump to have been made in the first place start with.

Only one person needs to see a spark start a fire and that knowledge becomes power. That power means a clan or tribe can survive.

Don’t get me wrong, I am not saying primitive equals thick. Its just a fire piston seems to be such high tech from a world where technology is not the norm.

 

[rich59]

My understanding is that the same society that produced the fire piston had also produced the blow pipe. Having seen examples of both I can see that the tube is pretty precisely the same diameter. So, I can see that they were familiar with an air tight seal down a narrow tube. I could envisage that experiments with darts that need to fit the tube exactly could have lead on to the fire piston. Or, polishing the inside of a blow pipe tube could have lead onto the invention.

 

[Hammock_man]

Yes but ....
I do see your point but at first glance it seems a loose connection. Still the need for fire would be such a prime mover that I would think that any idea that could lead to fire would be chased through time.

( maybe they invented the diesel engine first and thought, wait a minite got a much better idea......)

 

[pheasant plucker]

I really like fire pistons and one of the days I'll get round to trying to make one from clear acrylic as then you see the actual spark. I like others can on guess at how they came about but you can say exactly the same thing about the boomerang?? How did a culture develop that when there was no connection to anything else in there culture? Seems to me that quite a lot of tools don't come from pre planning but from simply picking something and saying hey that does a good job I wonder if I could make it better.......???
PP

 

[Hammock_man]

Very valid points.

Maybe its me but I can see me moving from throwing sticks at birds, to seeing a curve in the flight of the stick, to designing it to return. Still dont get the fire piston.....

And yes the clear one is well cool

 

[pheasant plucker]

There are some thoughts that the fire piston was introduced to asia by europeans, as airguns were about at the same time and because of dieseling in some airguns it's thought that's where fire pistons could have originated????? But I guess we'll never know the true origins unless a long lost cave drawing turns up of how to make a fire piston lmao ;-D
PP

 

[Cromm]

I read somewhere that it was made by a French airgun maker just before the match was made, But the match won in the end???/

 

[pheasant plucker]

I read somewhere that it was made by a French airgun maker just before the match was made, But the match won in the end???/

I've read similar things but none are definitive as to where it originally came from, but to be honest I'm not fussed as I enjoy using them ;-D

PP

 

[MartinK9]

Hope you didn't burn the table too much

 

[traderran]

looking good i like that

 

[Galemys]

Great video Bandel4, thank´s for sharing.

Here are some pictures of a bamboo fire piston (by the same maker as Bandel´s) that I just received today, thank´s a lot Ashley (BOD):You_Rock_

I had heard and read about fire pistons made from bamboo, even tried to make one myself (I failed miserably) but never seen one in real life before and now there was one delivered at my door!
I tried it out immediately after wetting the ´terap´ tree fibers that are used for the seal. They did not swell enough to make a close fit (probably because I was too eager and tried it out too fast) so I wound some more terap fiber around the piston end for a better fitting gasket. Then I loaded some ´lulut´ tinder (a very fluffy layer that can be found on the fish tail palm Caryota mitis) into the tinder cup, placed the piston inside the bamboo tube, hit the piston and out came a glowing coal
Clicking on the pictures will lead you to my photobucket account with bigger versions of the pic´s.

With the extra terap fiber added:


The bamboo fire piston in closed position, the terap fiber and fish tail palm ´lulut´ tinder are next to it. Lulut feels and looks remarkably like tumble drier (or bellybutton...) fluff but it´s way better as tinder:


Loaded with lulut tinder, the fire piston in the background is a hardwood one made by a fellow Dutchman, Mario Zwaneveld:


A glowing ember!


Cheers,

A very pleased Tom

 

[BOD]

Glad it arrived safely.

Actually Bandels is made by the first apprentice, yours by the feuermeister himself.

The bore is entirely natural - no boring required - and the bamboo taken just above the ground where the wall and node is thicker.

Your root cause analysis is correct. Wait till the fibres swell. You could also insert the piston with the wet fibres into the bore for several seconds. This seems to 'shape' the fibre to the bore.

Of course, if you used nice viscous spit there would be none of this faffing about with water!

More aboriginal goodies an a couple of months time. I will re-visit the Jakun in May and do what I can to revive the art there.

Thanks for all your research and help.

Ash

 

[hen]

Thanks to Bod for sharing 'fire piston' with us.
On a recent trip to an Orang Asli village, we got one made for us.
So, a few days ago, me and my misses sat down and made this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvZzTWej764

Cheers,
http://www.my-rainforest-adventures.com/

That's fantastic!

What types of UK native wood would be suitable for the different parts of one of these?

 

[Galemys]

What types of UK native wood would be suitable for the different parts of one of these?

Probably none...although PatrickM once posted one he made out of elderberry wood. But he's exceptional, he could probably make fire by rubbing two icicles together whilst making a kuksa out of granite.

Most woods are just too porous, the wood for a fire piston has to be very dense and airtight to withstand the built up air pressure. Oak and beech are hardish but porous, hornbeam could be a possible candidate to try. Resin-saturated fatwood could in theory be nonporous.

Cheers,

Tom

 

[Fraxinus]

To the question of which native timber might be used I would try European/English oak ( Quercus petraea ) . This "white oak" is used for barrel making due to having tyloses in the pores that resist the passage of fluids so will presumably resist air transference.
Just a thought.

Edit: Needs to be heartwood though as sapwood is permeable

 

[bandel4]

Hi everyone...glad that the video has generated some really interesting discussion.
Bod...you have got to show me the bamboo made that you sent to Galemys. Looks really good.

 

[Galemys]

I read somewhere that it was made by a French airgun maker just before the match was made, But the match won in the end???/

The match ´won´ because it gives an instant flame as opposed to a glowing coal. Try lighting a candle directly with a fire piston!
In a world where all homestead lighting was based on an open flame this was a big plus, especially when the safety match was invented which reduced the risk of ´spontaneous´ combustion of matchsticks in a box.

I believe the European fire pistons in the early 19th century and the appearance of fire pistons in SE Asia were independent inventions. Even in Europe the principle was seen in Italy, France and England without transferral of the idea, just a kind of serendipity and convergent evolution.
Although asian pistons are not mentioned before 1865, their wide distribution of usage in SE asia by ´wild´ tribes cannot be accounted to the European fire piston. It probably has more to do with the blowpipe theory, with small pestle and mortar combinations (used for crushing betel nuts) or with piston type air pumps that were used in blacksmithing in the area.

Cheers,

Tom