Insomniacs unite....

[Toddy]

You know that moment of realisation that you are just not going to get to sleep ? no matter how tired you are, or how much you need it, that everything's comfortable, nothing worrying at you, just the brain won't switch off, and there really, really is no point in trying any longer?
Well, it's back.
Hello, my name is Toddy and I can't sleep.

I'm trying the Valerian tea again, but I'd love just to quietly sleep even six hours straight. Seven would be luxury, and eight would be almost unheard of, but something of an ambition. This week I'm managing three, and like a toddler (hah! pun ) I'm needing an afternoon nap, and I manage all of half an hour then.
It's not enough.

Everyone else is sound asleep though, so I'm trying to be quiet, and that rather limits getting anything done. The net is handy, but as usual I find myself looking for information. Information on insomnia is a horribly mixed bag. Scholarly articles, joke forums, individuals blogs.....I don't think they help to be honest, I think they just get me thinking about sleep, well, not sleeping, instead of being conducive to head on pillow one moment and hours later it's time to get up, they rather waken up the mind even more.

So, insomniacs, here's a thread. Someplace to quietly ramble through a conversation.....and what do you actually do when you can't sleep either ?

It's a while since I camped, but somehow not being able to sleep when out isn't the same bother. Just quietly dress and go for a quiet wander around. Watch dawn come up long before daylight. Breath cold, clean fresh air and somehow be alert and in the moment.
It's cold here tonight, but not actually freezing. Just cold enough to say that Winter is still dragging Spring back. Big moon up there in the sky though, so good light outside. Surprising just how clear it can be to see in moonlight.
Somewhere there's a fox up to no good too, I can hear the frantic squawking of the ducks down the burn, and I saw the white ghostly silent flight of an owl ten minutes ago too. Busy old world out there something a lot of people just never see.
Do you wonder if that's why we're awake, that maybe we ought to be out and enjoying it ?

cheers,
Toddy

 

[MartinK9]

Just go with the flow; I know I'll crash in two or three days and have a good kip.

OK it'll be from 7am until 4pm but beggars can't be choosers.

I find solace in having a good old chuckle:

A few hours worth there to keep us going

 

[underground]

Have you read about 5HTP / Griffonia? I randomly came across it on eBay and read about it in bodybuilding forums and it sounded appealing enough to try during a period when I was struggling to sleep. It could be coincidence but I seemed to get to sleep really easily and stay asleep all night.
Another one I’ve heard about is ZMA. I take that so I get enough magnesium which in turn is supposed to ensure that the body gets/uses sufficient vitamin D especially in winter. Loads of reports of it being a great sleep supplement.

 

[dwardo]

Shame you aren't closer Mary you could keep autumn company.. We have had the odd full night's sleep since she was born but generally she is rubbish at sleeping. Last night she was wide awake from 12 till near 4. It's slowly breaking us.

Espresso time!

 

[bobnewboy]

I’ve never been a good sleeper, but I find the 4-7-8 breathing process helps me a lot. In fact when I heard about it, I realised that I had been doing it, or something very similar, for years. It is a conscious thing which helps me drift off, and that seems counterintuitive, but for whatever reason it does seem to work for me

 

[Bishop]

Hello, my name is Bishop and I cannot sleep...


I was reading a fascinating article about the history of breathable waterproof materials when I suddenly found myself on a pirate movie website watching re-runs of the Man From Uncle and in the zone with my knitting.

No idea what it's going to be yet , suggestions welcome


Scholarly articles aside it's important to remember this whole eight hour sleep thing is an invention of the industrial revolution not human evolution and the medieval practice of First & Second sleep is well documented. Though between the medication I am on and Julies worsening spinal problems we sometimes slip into Watch system of 8hrs awake followed by four asleep. It can be a problem being out synch with the rest of the world but it sort of works. However once the mercury creeps a little higher over the coming weeks that tends to snap me back onto Daylight Foraging Time

 

[Toddy]

Shame you aren't closer Mary you could keep autumn company.. We have had the odd full night's sleep since she was born but generally she is rubbish at sleeping. Last night she was wide awake from 12 till near 4. It's slowly breaking us.

Espresso time!

When my eldest son was born, and Jamie just did not sleep. Well, I lie, he still only needs five hours in 24 to absolutely thrive, and he has been pretty much that all his life. I was absolutely shattered, he fed well (from me) he was waaaay ahead of all infant markers of development, but he did not sleep. I sat at my Dad's and was ready to cry. It all poured out, and the old Toddy just laughed. Really laughed. He said,
"It's lovely to hear you get your own back ! because you did that to us too. We had to spell each other off all night long, two hours asleep two hours awake.
An old neighbour said to give you some whisky in warm milk. We actually tried it. You sang all night instead. (I still can't carry a tune straight ) so we didn't do it again.
Then you learned to talk, so you just talked all night long instead. Eventually we just left you in your cot with a few simple oftoys to chatter away and doze off when you felt like it.
He'll grow up ! "
and I was upset at the time, but my Dad was right.
Make a safe comfortable place for her to be nearby you. Once she stops crying and starts nattering it's an awful lot easier, it really is, but I'm sorry you're going through this just now. It feels never ending at the time.
I have promised both my sons that if they ever have children, and they are the same way as Jamie and I were, I'll come over and do the night shift. I know it won't last forever and it would let the parents sleep well and get on with life a lot more easily.

M

 

[Janne]

Staring at a computer screen is supposed to be one of the worst actions you do before sleeping time!

 

[Toddy]

Yep, It's a last gasp thing for me though. I'd already tried reading, sewing, watercolours...there's not an awful lot one can do that doesn't disturb others who are sleeping. I had taken the Valerian tea just before I sat down here though, and I went to bed when I finished.....and I slept for another couple of hours

M

 

[oldtimer]

Becoming an OAP and no longer having to work helped. Mind you, it took over five years before the recurrent nightmares of organisational failures of school journeys and managing inadequate budgets began to recede. What is it about the human brain that needs to seek something to worry about when there is no need? Re-programming is needed, but how?

When I had to work to an externally imposed pattern I found that the knowledge that I just had to get up however bad the night had been was the worst thing: and why is it easy to sleep when it is time to get up but not in the middle of the night ?
(Q: Mum, why do I have to go to school? The teachers don't like me and the kids are horrible. A: Because you're 45 years old and the headteacher!)

My father-in-law, a very creative but stressed film maker, told me that he had the most tremendous ideas in the middle of sleepless nights but had completely forgotten them in the morning. He decided to put a pencil and pad beside the bed to jot down the best ideas. After a week of this he realised that, in the cold light of day, all the ideas were total rubbish. However, the act of writing them down did stop the feverish repetition of his night thoughts and made for a better night's sleep. Might be worth a try.

 

[Broch]

I read somewhere recently that the act of cooling down is soporific so the recommendation was to take a hot bath immediately before trying to sleep. I could go to sleep on a bed of nails, anywhere, anytime (sorry) so I've never tried it!

 

[Toddy]

The truly annoying thing is that so could I, but not now. Pain used to wake me up and I rather got out of the way of sleeping the whole night through.
I've slept on top of sacks of tatties (farm camp, the heavens opened, we didn't have down mats and airbeds in them days) on shingle beaches (surprisingly warm and comfortable if you get the sun and tides right) in a sleeping bag just on top of the burden boards in a dory.....and now I can't manage 6 or 7 hours straight on a comfortable divan bed.

I'm starting to think the first sleep and second sleep idea might not be a bad idea. Just plan ahead a little and have something quiet to do set up, with a flask of hot tea too, in my workroom. It's warmer in there than the rest of the house anyway during the night, and I could just work quietly for an hour or so and then try sleeping again without having to disturb anyone.

M

 

[oldtimer]

I came across the first and second sleep concept in "Montaillou" by Ladurie. For those not familiar with it, it is an account of investigations into the Cathars of Languedoc in the 14th century and is rich in unwitting testimony about rural peasant life. As a result of the 19th century industrial revolution, we now live to the clock rather than to the sun and the season and sleep problems are a consequence, in my view.

Since I have no longer had to get up and go to work by the clock, I have lived a medieval rural peasant lifestyle and no longer suffer from insomnia.

 

[snappingturtle]

Are house is a regular for late ones Sammi will at times be playing a game till 3-4 am, and I tinker quietly there is more peace at these times, less people awake messing and putting ripples in the creative cosmic energy pool but seriously some of my best creativity comes in the witching hours.

 

[Fadcode]

The only time I couldn't sleep is when I worried about not sleeping., now, I sleep when I want to, and if that means I nap in the afternoon then thats what I do, we are conditioned to sleep when it goes dark, and sometimes we are not in the need of sleep when it goes dark, if you think back a few years(well ok 30-40 years) TV finished at midnight, radio stopped at midnight, we didnt have mobile phones, computers, etc etc, and the only thing we could do is sleep, nowadays we do too much and I think we have forgotten how to relax and turn our brains off so that we can enjoy sleep.

 

[daveO]

I have trouble going to sleep and I have trouble waking up. Having a baby has been a great help to me as I have an excuse not to go to bed until 2am. My concentration levels are much higher when it's dark outside for some reason so I get loads of work done after 9pm. I've even learned to draw on CAD one handed if I need to hold the baby at the same time. I still have to avoid caffeine after about 4pm and no sugar at all after dinner or my brain kicks in to overdrive. I have to stop work and read a book in low light at least half an hour before I wake my wife up to give the baby his early morning dream feed though otherwise it takes an hour for my brain to wind down. This sleeping pattern suits me but I prefer to wake up before 7am in the spring and summer and have time to do stuff in the garden or walk the dog before I start work. It's never been too bad for us with the baby though since my wife naturally wakes at about 5am so she's happy to be up early with him and I'm wired to stay up late. A few nights though he's been wide awake at 3:30am blowing raspberries and giggling his head off in his cot. It's too funny for us to mind too much

 

[KenThis]

Through trial and error I've found chess videos on YouTube help me, unlikely as that sounds.
I try not to worry too much about it anymore though.
I found trying to get to sleep makes it harder to fall asleep as it were.

At one stage my anxiety got so bad that I'd sometimes have minor panic attacks trying to fall asleep.
Someone counterintuitively suggested having a really hot shower and then getting into a cool bed, which helped a lot.
I also found that a good way to let go of worries for the night was to make lists. I'd make a list of the things that needed doing/making me worry, and how and when I would deal with the thing. Once I had everything written down I'd be much calmer and find sleep easier.

Luckily nowadays the puppy helps me sleep, when she gets tired she lollops on my lap wanting a good cwtch, so relaxing, puts me out like a light.

 

[MartinK9]

Another day.......

 

[Nice65]

Another day.......

Another night

I get a silly thing, a sleep anxiety. It doesn't happen often, times of trouble, appointments etc have me tossing and turning in bed increasingly fearful of "not sleeping". It's a vicious circle, which of course becomes bigger at night. Hence me in BCUK now, with my blue light screen on, giving my brain the green light for stimulation.

Off to my bed again now after my hot tea, sleep well folks.

 

[snappingturtle]

I've been a night owl since I was 11, I think some of us just are made to be night creatures, I got into a job that suited that, (security) basically I took a problem and found a way to get paid for it, mint! I sleep when the mind lets me other wise I just rest in the dark, its not about sleep just a massive reduction in info coming in, and have music on, I find Vhaun William good but saying that I have been know to drift off to Slayer and Techno! I do cat nap and this sometimes happen in the bath and apparently I make the odd piggy snuffling noise when I do , thing is you can get by on very little your body has its own rhythm, it may not match to the tick of the world, but what the hell!