I bought a Clipper, now what the heck do I do with it?

[addyb]

Well, I broke down and bought a Frosts Clipper stainless in 12c27 Sandvik steel.

Now, I've read and heard amazing things about this steel and what it can do, but I also know that the knife is going to take a lot of work for the steel to reach this point.

So I ask you knife guru's out there, what sort of sharpening method should I be using on my new Clipper to "bring out the best" in the steel?

Ugh...the sheath is a horrible orange plastic, but the handle seems to grip nice.

Wish me luck!

Adam

 

[Tutchi]

Well, I broke down and bought a Frosts Clipper stainless in 12c27 Sandvik steel.

Now, I've read and heard amazing things about this steel and what it can do, but I also know that the knife is going to take a lot of work for the steel to reach this point.

So I ask you knife guru's out there, what sort of sharpening method should I be using on my new Clipper to "bring out the best" in the steel
Wish me luck!
Adam

Hi Adam
iI preferred the carbon steel though I have both. Straight out of the parcel they were fine. Are you saying yours is blunt?

Tutchi

 

[Bardster]

put a nice convex grind on it

To be honest they are usually pretty good straight out the box. touch up on a sharpmaker and you will be fine.

IF you want a stronger edge less likely to chip then do indeed put a convex edge on it - in the middle of doig that with my 9" stromeng!!
Do a search for hoodoo hone and that will give you some good guidance.
Basically wet and dry and a mouse mat

 

[addyb]

No, it's not blunt, it slices paper. But, it's not at the point that I think I could slice wood all day and have it hold up. It's not quite shaving sharp yet.

Also, I've never worked with a Scandi grind yet, so I really have no idea which sparpening method I should use, 400 grit wet/dry paper, or my arkansas oilstones, or my synthetic carbide bench stone.

Any help would be appreciated.

Cheers,

Adam

 

[RovingArcher]

I use 600 and 1500 w/d paper when my Mora's need sharpening, but a simple stropping over the 1500 brings them back up to snuff after use.

All of my Mora's required stropping over leather to bring them to razor, hair popping sharpness and they hold their edge pretty well during field use. Convexing the edge will make it more durable, sharper and give it better edge retention.

The only one of the Mora's I own, that has the 12c27 steel is the Eriksson Mora 2000, which is their wilderness/outdoorsmans knife. Because of blade configuration, it easily out performs both the Frost and Eriksson Mora Swedish Army Knives (SwAK) during field use. I much prefer the 12c27 over the carbon for ease of upkeep.

 

[British Red]

No, it's not blunt, it slices paper. But, it's not at the point that I think I could slice wood all day and have it hold up. It's not quite shaving sharp yet.

Also, I've never worked with a Scandi grind yet, so I really have no idea which sparpening method I should use, 400 grit wet/dry paper, or my arkansas oilstones, or my synthetic carbide bench stone.

Any help would be appreciated.

Cheers,

Adam

Addy,

A ggod bench stone set is the way to go. I prefer waterstones, but do use oilstones on my field tools.

Okay, start with a medium stone (say about 1,000 grit). Lay the kife blade flat on the stone, handle to one side. Rock forward till the scandi grind is flat on the stone (blade away from you). Push away as though trying to shave a molecule of stone off. Repeat 20 times. Turn knife over and do the same on the other side for 20 cycles. Now do 20 alternate on each side. Step up to a fine stone (say 6,000 grit). Do it again til the scandi is finely polished - you may have to do several repeats. Use a fine polishing stone to finish (10,000 grit).

Nope not done yet. 50 strops on a razor strop (or leather belt), rough side then smooth side

Nope still not done. Now get a kitchen steel. DONT PUSH. No gentler still - really, think stropping on silk. Lay the scandy on it and stroke 10 times in alternate directions

Now go shave

Red

 

[mark a.]

It would seem a bit of a shame to get a scandi knife and put a convex or sharpmaker edge on it - almost defeats the point in getting one in the first place.

I used a waterstone on my (carbon) clipper - my Norton 4000/8000 plus a good strop brought it up really nice. Took a fair bit of time and effort though (the grit was waay too fine - I have a 1000 grit stone on its way) so presumably with the stainless you'll need a good going over too. Depends on what your oilstones or bench stones are like. Give them a go. The great thing about scandis is that they automatically give you the perfect angle - just lay it flat on the stone and away you go.

 

[bushtuckerman]

I struggle to understand the benefits of a convex grind on a fixed knife; i have never owned one, but i have several Mora's. I understand the points about edge retention and chipping, and i think i understand why axes can profiled this way as well (because they're being hurled at often hard wood right?). I just have the hang up that that profile would be more difficult to pass through wood when carving delicately. Don't want to hijack the thread but maybe for everyone's benefit some of the more experienced among us could go into some detail? maybe it just 'is'!

cheers,

ian

p.s. and oh yeah, what kind of degree of a convex curve do you normally sharpen then to? thanks

 

[wizard]

The Clippers that I have would shave or split hairs! The stainless one came as sharp as any knife I have ever handled. The carbon steel one needed a few strokes on a waterstone and a stropping. I am with some of the others, why waste a good Scandi edge by using a sharpmaker or convex grinding it? The Scandi edge blades are so easy to sharpen and very sturdy edges. I have plenty of "modern" edge knives and hate to sharpen them, they are a real workout to get sharp enough to be useful. The Scandi edge is a pleasure to sharpen and really easy to get shaving sharp! Just my two pence. Cheers!

 

[addyb]

I gotta say this: THANKS for the advice!

I sat in my garage with my benchstone and worked away at my Clipper for a while.

And....

*gulp* It's SCARY sharp.

heheh I think I like 12c27 steel!

I'm definately satisfied with this blade.

Cheers,

Adam

 

[British Red]

I gotta say this: THANKS for the advice!

I sat in my garage with my benchstone and worked away at my Clipper for a while.

And....

*gulp* It's SCARY sharp.

heheh I think I like 12c27 steel!

I'm definately satisfied with this blade.

Cheers,

Adam

Glad to help! It does show that a really good knife need not be expensive huh?

 

[addyb]

Yes it is. I realized today that I don't need to go and spent $300 dollars on a bushcraft knife when an inexpensive Frosts Mora will do the job just as nicely. All it took was a bit of work to sharpen the blade and a bit of understanding about Scandi grinds.

I went for the Stainless version simply because the weather where I live is really awful 90% of the time. I've had carbon knives before, but I found that I ended up spending too much time on their upkeep.

I read that Sandvik 12c27 stainless is excellent steel, and hardened to about 59HRC. I found today that it was fairly easy to sharpen, and before it got dark outside I went and fooled around with it on some hard wood. So far, I'm impressed.

Anyway, thanks to everyone for your advice.

Adam

 

[OldJimbo]

Mark, Ian - some of us have fully convexed Moras and seen benefits in comparison with identical Scandi blades - for some work. All in all, though, fully convexing is tough to do properly, even with a belt grinder and some experience. On the other thread I gave some details of using a large sanding pad - a drywall sander we call them here, to "slightly" convex and even both the blade flats and bevels. The top shoulders of Mora bevels are also uneven so we round them off somewhat.
Basically the blade once repolished looks very much as though nothing has been done except for the rounded top shoulders, and that needn't be very much. I find that the blade then moves through wood much more smoothly and I can get fuzzies out of tough wood much faster.
Naturally after I found all this out, I then found lots of other people like Webley had been doing it for years...

 

[bushtuckerman]

Thanks OldJimbo, how do you find sharpening in the field?

I have found that due to lack of experience and lack of suitable stones (i have a hand diamond sharpener and hand arkansas wet stone and a strong piece of leather - basically a field kit but not a base kit), that at the tip of my helle (still don't know what it is exactly!) the profile has become convex when the rest of the blade is flat ground, and funnily enogh is sharper and has less burrs and nicks. I was thinking i might get a wa****a(sp?) stone, and a large diamond backed ceramic stone while i'm at it as well.

cheers

 

[mark a.]

Mark, Ian - some of us have fully convexed Moras and seen benefits in comparison with identical Scandi blades - for some work. All in all, though, fully convexing is tough to do properly, even with a belt grinder and some experience. On the other thread I gave some details of using a large sanding pad - a drywall sander we call them here, to "slightly" convex and even both the blade flats and bevels. The top shoulders of Mora bevels are also uneven so we round them off somewhat.
Basically the blade once repolished looks very much as though nothing has been done except for the rounded top shoulders, and that needn't be very much. I find that the blade then moves through wood much more smoothly and I can get fuzzies out of tough wood much faster.
Naturally after I found all this out, I then found lots of other people like Webley had been doing it for years...

Maybe you're right. But for your first scandi? Might as well get used to that first, then perhaps convex it. I'll shortly be trying to convex my SAK to see what it's like, but even if it's revalatory I'll probably still keep the clipper as a scandi and get another non-scandi blade and convex that (or just get an F1...)

 

[Hoodoo]

I struggle to understand the benefits of a convex grind on a fixed knife; i have never owned one, but i have several Mora's. I understand the points about edge retention and chipping, and i think i understand why axes can profiled this way as well (because they're being hurled at often hard wood right?). I just have the hang up that that profile would be more difficult to pass through wood when carving delicately. Don't want to hijack the thread but maybe for everyone's benefit some of the more experienced among us could go into some detail? maybe it just 'is'!

cheers,

ian

p.s. and oh yeah, what kind of degree of a convex curve do you normally sharpen then to? thanks

I think you raise some good questions. Personally, I like the full scandi grind for woodcarving, especially for making long, straight planing cuts. For woodsbumming, adding a small secondary bevel or convexing the edge (not a full convex) will strengthen the edge a bit. Since convexing the edge still leaves it with a continuously smooth bevel, it doesn't affect penetration all that much. Neither does adding a very slight secondary bevel. A woodcarver using seasoned wood would notice the difference but in the field, I don't think you will see much practical difference, especially on green wood. Also, a small secondary bevel or convex edge is good at rolling those wood curls so your fuzz sticks can look nice and curly.

 

[mark a.]

Is convexing "new"? I'm by no means a knife expert, but I get the impression that it's some kind of recent-ish phenomenon - everyone seems to be doing it (including myself shortly, it seems!) Is it new, or is it that knives tend not to come with convex edges (because it's difficult to do during manufacturing, perhaps?) thus it's something that you have to do yourself to get a good profile for buschcrafting, carving or whatever?

 

[Shinken]

I wouldnt have thought it was new, it may have become more popular recently though.

I have to say i prefere scandi grinds! personally i think covex is for chopping and suited for axes. And scandi grind suits finer detail carving and suits knives better. personall opinion of course

Ash

 

[OldJimbo]

It'd be a mistake to think of what I do to Moras as convexing. It's just evening up the flats. both the bevels and flat sides of the blade are concave from factory grinding - and pretty uneven. If a person did the honing with flat stones and called the end result a "precision" Scandi - then they'd see about the same improvement. More important - as the scratches from the stones really showed the uneveness of the flats and shoulder - they'd know why an improvement was going to happen.
A drywall sander being rubber backed is pretty cheap and convenient as a sharpening instrument. It will also show a person things that they didn't want to know about their convex blades, too... since the fine scratches bring out all the high and low spots. I'd certainly agree that a person wanting a proper spine to edge convex with a large blade should go out and buy a convex blade - but only when it's met the sanding pad will that person know if they got their money's worth.
In the end - it's just something to try and see for yourself.

I do very little resharpening outdoors, and usually only carry some emery paper and use a belt as a strop. I've very rarely needed to do much with the Moras, but I really like a Murphy knife and that one needed sharpening as I went, until the edge was honed back.

 

[addyb]

No, convex-ing isn't new, I found out about while googling information on the steel used in SAK's and how to bring out the best in it. I was brought to a page that mentioned using progressively finer wet-dry paper on a mousepad to convex the edge bevel on a SAK. Of course, I could not convex the entire blades of mine, but even doing just the bevel made a huge difference in terms of edge retention. Have a look at another post of mine from a couple days a ago called "Good gawd, convex edges really DO work."

I found that even by spending all afternoon slicing and carving hard wood with my SAK, the new one I bought around christmas time (that's another of my posts) and my older, daily carry knife - they both held up very well. At the end of the day, while they were no longer shaving sharp, both would still slice paper. After a quick strop on the mousepad, both were once more returned to shaving sharp.

I will warn you, Mark: I ruined my oldest SAK in the process of learning how to properly use the "Hoodoo Stone" (the one my Grandfather gave to me) and get the pressure and angle right. I'd say that when you're learning how to do this, find an old sh*tty blade that you have laying around, and mess around with that.

But getting back to the Clipper, I was thinking some more last night about Sandvik stainless, so I googled it before I went to bed. I'm thinking that because it's make up and the way it's tempered for edge retention and ease of sharpening, it won't be quite as stain resistant as other steels in it's range. It's a tradeoff, wouldn't you guys say?

Cheers,

Adam