Fun for Lazy kids

[Druss]

Has anybody got any suggestions to keep lazy brain-dead computer addict kids entertained on a camp-site or out in the woods through the day or on an evening?
Here's the situation. My wife an I get out camping a lot, winter and summer lately. We have a great time just the 2 of us either on a camp-site or out in the woods somewhere. All this summer though we have been taking our 2 nephews out with us and although they say they enjoy it and want to go again they just have no get up and go about them or any enthusiasm for learning anything out there. One is 15 and the other is 10, the reason we are taking them as pretty much there entire lives have been spent sat in their bedrooms playing computer games.

Neither of them have ever even climbed a tree or know how to ride a bike or anything, they have zero social skills and are both, as you can imagine grossly overweight and unfit. Trying to just get them to collect firewood is a nightmare. First we took them with us to collect wood which ended up with me getting mad and the older one sulking because I had to keep telling him to collect wood and not just watch us do it. We have tried telling them they have to have their own fire which they collect the wood for and if they don't get enough they won't be able to cook their food. Well that didn't work and they came back with hardly anything but a few damp twigs and ended they ended up cooking on our fire. The last time I sent them out alone to gather wood, I tried to make it a challenge and bit of a competition to see who could get the most. The youngest came back with a few twigs in his bag and a big damp mossy stick that he picked up because it looked like Gandalf's staff. The older one had some sticks poking through the drawstring of his 60l rucksack so I though maybe he gad surprised me and it was at least full to bursting, but alas as he tipped it upside down about 8 twigs fell out. I told them both I was disappointed and had warned them both before the trip if they don't start pulling their weight then I will stop taking them. We went one time with a few others and 3 other kids, I thought that might bring them out of their shells and get them into it but it didn't, one of the other kids was great, kept mucking in, had the kind of energy I wish I still had for running up big hills to get dead branches and he was curious and wanting to learn as much as he could. The other kids were unfortunately the same or quite possibly worse than the nephews. The just wanted to sit on there arses all weekend and talk about minecraft.

I'm at a dilemma here now as I really don't want to stop taking them as I know if me and my wife don't take them, they will never go anywhere and their mother will just let them sit in their bedroom staring at a computer screen. I didn't know the kids growing up properly as they are on my wifes side of the family but it seems they have always lived this way, gaming and stuffing themselves full of sugar every waking hour of the day when they are not at school. They are so very very far removed from what I was like as a kid that I really don't know what to do for the best. I don't want to ruin every summer camping trip by having them with us having to carry them and thus ruining any chance we have of having a good time, but I don't want to give up on them either.

I know that this kind of lifestyle is normal for a lot of kids today so thought I would try here and see if any of you have had experience with this generation of kid in the outdoors and do you have any suggestions for getting them more into it? We will probably fit one more trip in before the school holidays are over so I was hoping to find ways to make it more entertaining for them as they don't seem to see the woods as the best playground in the world as I used to (and still do if I'm honest).

Thanks in advance for any help I hope I have put this in the right forum if not I apologise.

 

[mountainm]

Are they into minecraft? Sell projects to them in a language they understand. Minecraft has lots of parallels to bushcraft.

 

[THOaken]

Hi, Druss. I'm sure a lot of the older folks will have more valuable input here, but I thought I might add a little something.

That's a rather unfortunate situation to be in, but your tenacity is commendable. I can't claim to have the same childhood background as yourself but when I was about 5-10 I do remember going outside and playing football and running around doing nothing much at all. I was born in '93 so unfortunately I was caught by the technology bug as I got older. I was rather like these kids even into my mid teens. I would sit on the computer all day. There would be weeks where I wouldn't go outside. I didn't know a single species of tree. Long story short, I grew out of sitting on my computer all day and now what do you know I'm in education to become a ranger/ecologist. I never thought I would change, yet in the past 4 or so years I've made immense life improvements. I go running most days, get out to a nature park every chance I get, volunteer as much as possible and take part in outdoor events, and so forth. My parents really are not outdoors people at all, although they do enjoy the occasional walk. I had to reevaluate my entire way of thinking by myself and now I can't stand being indoors.

The point is, people can change. Those kids are lucky to have people to guide them (even if they are reluctant). It's even worse for kids these days as technology has advanced so much in such a short space of time. But what about making it less like a chore and try to connect the indoor time with the outdoor time? Why not use the whole Minecraft computer game to your advantage? Why not pretend like it is a game? You would think that since Minecraft is outdoor themed that they'd be interesting in seeing its real life equivalent.

Good luck, mate.

 

[Druss]

Thanks for the responses. I must confess I have limited knowledge of minecraft, although I do own it. It's an interesting idea and I can see comparison between the 2. I'll boot it up one day next week and see what I can come up with. My flint and steel got a reaction which was to do with minecraft. I couldn't find any materials this weekend due to all the rain but already got the wife cutting up one of my work shirts to do some char cloth for next time. Was going to buy them each one of the cheap firesteels on amazon

 

[Harvestman]

As a strategy you can try flat refusing to do anything for them at all. It may force them to do stuff themselves, and then if you respond with praise and support they might start taking part.

On the other hand it may lead to a huge fit of the sulks or an argument. There's an argument that you cannot force people to enjoy themselves. Horses to water etc

One of the best ways to engage with youngsters is to show enthusiasm yourself, communicating to them that you are having a great time. Food is a natural way to engage, say with bannock. Make a bannock, but keep a variety of flavourings back. Then you say how delicious yours is, and would they like one themselves? If yes, which flavour would they like? Toasted marshmallows? You'd better find your own stick then...

For me, the key is praise. Whatever they do, however small, it must be praised, or at least thanked for, so that they get positive feedback. Start by doing with them, then gradually give independence.

 

[Toddy]

I suspect that you are discouraging rather than encouraging them.
It's not your fault, it's just the reality of a total culture clash. It's greatly to your credit that you are making such an effort to engage them.

Instead of taking them for a weekend, take them out somewhere for the day. Make it fun, not a chore. Buy them a hammock and rig it up in the garden. Show them how to put a tarp up, have a night around a brazier and then do some stargazing. Let them decide if they want to sleep in or out.
Have 'natural' foods on the brazier, do the whole cook it on a stick, inside half an orange, cook it in a paper bag, wrap it in grass and clay and bake it in hot embers, type stuff.
Play with the whole firelighting range, from flint and steel to firebow.

The brambles are ripening, we'll still be picking them into late September here. They're sour to tastebuds ruined by too much sugar and fizz, but take them and gather the fruits, make jam, jelly, peach and bramble cobbler. Food for free if you know what you're doing

Try orienteering taster days, or the hidden geocaches.

You have to make the natural world appealling not work. Swamping them with immersion in it's not working, so just gently enrich life with it's awareness. Let them get used to the seasons, not just the Christmas, Easter, Summer holidays type thing.

Just my tuppence halfpenny worth

cheers,
Toddy…..Mum to two computer/electronics able sons, but who are both capable outside too

 

[mick91]

It must be hard to get kids into it from that kind of age range, I was into the outdoors from being tiny. I suppose though safety dictating (area you do it in) taking something like a catty or even making a sling could help. Practice at rattling tins etc. I've had similar trouble even with adults, as soon as hard work is involved they aren't happy, but if they took the time to think and try they would realise it isn't actually that hard it's all about technique. As for collecting firewood, I can imagine that to be the difficult part. Although as a kid the thought of being allowed a machete or axe would have filled me with you. I've been trusted with blades, catapults, firearms etc from being very young and it's done me no lasting harm, and the first time a knife bites you you learn to be sensible with them almost instantly

 

[THOaken]

Thanks for the responses. I must confess I have limited knowledge of minecraft, although I do own it. It's an interesting idea and I can see comparison between the 2. I'll boot it up one day next week and see what I can come up with. My flint and steel got a reaction which was to do with minecraft. I couldn't find any materials this weekend due to all the rain but already got the wife cutting up one of my work shirts to do some char cloth for next time. Was going to buy them each one o?f the cheap firesteels on amazon

Can you tell me what other games they play? There may be other connections to be made. My point is not to make them think about games whilst outdoors, but maybe to try and get them to see that the outdoors can be full of adventure and a place to accomplish goals without it having to seem like a tiresome, dirty and pointless chore. As for Minecraft, from what I can remember, it's essentially a game about surviving outdoors and building shelters. It's very bushcrafty actually. You'd think the young ones would want to do that sort of thing in real life.

Can I ask, do the kids act differently at all when not in your company? I don't know the full story, of course, but might this be a case of the typical kid not wanting to participate in the presence of adults? You know, that whole thing of not being "cool". Or is this really just more about the fact that they're so unused to physical work and activity that they can't be bothered to do simple tasks.

All I can really think about right now is try to engage them in conversation about Minecraft. Maybe ask them what they like about it. If they say that they like building things, then you can tell them to look around, all the materials you'd need to build a shelter are right here. That sort of thing.

 

[dragon32]

Hi Druss,
You could try incorporating the two streams by which I mean letting them lead the expedition with a compass on the mobile phone, or geocaching and navigating to the prize. I equip mine with a digital camera too so they can take pictures to show their friends and school. Let them light the fire. Its much more interesting that watching you do it. Start with the technology and work from there.

ATB,
Don

 

[THOaken]

Great ideas, Dragon32. You reminded me of something. You can get apps on your mobile phone for flora and fauna i.d. If the kids are stuck to their mobile phones whilst camping, you could try and let them use one such app and form a competition out of it. The first one to i.d as many plants or birds in the wood gets a prize.

 

[Druss]

The eldest one is really into a game called Warthunder a flying combat sim, he's also really into the Fallout games which is something we have in common. The youngest one is just Minecraft all the way. I try to get them to go off and do things on their own but they both cling to us like glue and when given the choice they will just choose to sit in camp. I suggested shelter building on this last trip as the older one watched a couple of those Ed Stafford episodes together and he liked the lean to but neither of them could be bothered and showed no interest at all in having a go. I even showed them some pictures of a couple of shelters me and my wife have had a go at, one of which we slept in. It seems they like the idea of something but have no interest in actually doing it.

As regards how they act when they are away from us it's hard to say. When we went with the group with the other kids we let the kids have a fire pit to themselves while the adults sat round the other. They all talk to each other angrily as if they have their xbox live headsets on. They argue a lot, i remember me and my friends arguing a lot too and i think it is good for social development in the long run. We also sent them all out into the woods with no particular goal but i gave them an old tree identification book of mine where you can write in when and where you saw a species, my mini binoculars. We said if they see any dry materials for a tinder bundle like the ones we had made the night before then we would be grateful. They were back less than an hour later on of them crying and my oldest nephew going to sulk in his tent, i talked to him and brought him round eventually.

 

[Druss]

We do tend to keep quite an active camp, there is always something going on be it chopping and sawing or something else, i took the stones and sharpened my hatchet and knife on this trip and we made some nettle cordage to tie a bin bag up for use. Neither wanted to have a go at any of this, they watched for a little bit and i tried to teach them what i was doing but got no interest at all. When we had the other kids Dad's with us between us we made a really good wind break by driving sticks into the ground and weaving twigs in between, they all tried to get the kids involved but only one of them showed any interest at all and refused to have a go.

The idea of refusing them anything at all was the idea with telling them they had to have their own fire, my wife would never make them go without in the long run though and I think they saw the empty threat in the situation.

 

[Druss]

Cheers Toddy, it's tricky as they aren't our kids so we have very little influence on them outside of the camping trips. We try taking them for days out places. We tried a place the other week in Bradford the has a zip line, big rope swing, l-slide, bucking bronco and the like. But they wouldn't have a go on anything at all, they clung near us and looked miserable. It was really hard work, they are so socially arkward and won't ever go mix with other kids or anything. Neither really have any friends outside of their xbox friends. They are extremely lazy. We have tried short walks with us when we take our dog out but they both complain and moan they are tired, I end up wondering why I bother, we don't force them to do any of these things we ask them if they want to come or not.

 

[THOaken]

Cheers Toddy, it's tricky as they aren't our kids so we have very little influence on them outside of the camping trips. We try taking them for days out places. We tried a place the other week in Bradford the has a zip line, big rope swing, l-slide, bucking bronco and the like. But they wouldn't have a go on anything at all, they clung near us and looked miserable. It was really hard work, they are so socially arkward and won't ever go mix with other kids or anything. Neither really have any friends outside of their xbox friends. They are extremely lazy. We have tried short walks with us when we take our dog out but they both complain and moan they are tired, I end up wondering why I bother, we don't force them to do any of these things we ask them if they want to come or not.

It's not really my place to say, but what if perhaps there would be a greater change in the kids' actions and personalities by actually speaking to their parents and getting them to limit time spent on PC and junk food consumption, Druss? Perhaps even just raise the concern subtly.

 

[Druss]

It must be hard to get kids into it from that kind of age range, I was into the outdoors from being tiny. I suppose though safety dictating (area you do it in) taking something like a catty or even making a sling could help. Practice at rattling tins etc. I've had similar trouble even with adults, as soon as hard work is involved they aren't happy, but if they took the time to think and try they would realise it isn't actually that hard it's all about technique. As for collecting firewood, I can imagine that to be the difficult part. Although as a kid the thought of being allowed a machete or axe would have filled me with you. I've been trusted with blades, catapults, firearms etc from being very young and it's done me no lasting harm, and the first time a knife bites you you learn to be sensible with them almost instantly

I have let them both have a go with saw and the older one with the hatchet, but i could not get him to understand the importance of not having his leg in range of his axe swing if he misses, i had to pull him on it well over a dozen times in about half an hour. I too carried a pen knife from an early age and was hoping to buy them both one at some point as their Dad is not around and i still remember getting my first knife fondly. But neither of them have shown me that they can be trusted enough to have any kind of edged tool. The older one just wanted to swing my hatchet above his head like they do in skyrim when chopping wood, when my wife tried to show him how to use it properly and safely he just lost interes straight away,

 

[dragon32]

On my mobile I also have the knot tying app that they can use to tie hammocks and tarps and traps. I have a fungi identification app (not that I let them eat them before I've identified them) and as previously mentioned we have a prize for the most wood and the best(driest and type) of wood collected. This is usually an extra desert item or for the eldest of mine a new(cheap) Mora knife. My kids would do it without the prizes just to outdo each other.

ATB,
Don

 

[Druss]

Thanks for that, I tried showing them how to use the real compass and map but they were not taking it in at all, but the oldest one has a smartphone so i could look for some apps that would be of use. I have let the oldest one light the fire on every trip so far. He is keen to do it but gets annoyed when he can't do it, when he gets like that he refuses any help or advice and just gives up. This last trip i made it really easy for him and had all the materials laid out ready to go, even got him some birch bark. He did it and got it going and i was chuffed for him. He just has no interest in learning about the materials or structure or actually building and maintaining the fire.

 

[GGTBod]

Bah modern kids, bring back the 70's anyday, we knew how to be kids

 

[Stevie777]

It's not just young kids, I took my son and 5 of his friends,17+, on a all nighter down the woods, I sent them away with a saw to cut the branches from a fallen tree..Pitiful to say the least, One even brought a tin of deodorant and spare underpants in his man bag. They all had Skinny jeans on and some even wore pointy shoes, unlaced of course.

I came back from collecting wood to find them using the Deodorant can as a flame thrower. Lord help them.

 

[Druss]

Thanks i just checked google play store and there are quite a lot. Got to be worth a go. Neither are great readers mind but i will have a look at some of them and see what is good, I have books but i guess they must seem like dusty old scrolls to kids these days.