Buying a bow drill kit - why?

[Clouston98]

I bought a kit of ebay for a tenner and still couldn't get an ember it's probably my technique as I've never had any help with the bow drill from someone who can do it.

The reason I bought the kit was so that I could have an idea of what it should look like, feel like, handle like and so on.i then hoped to use the kit to get experience so then I could make and use my own. But as I couldn't get the kit to work either I haven't got round to making my own.

However the kit I bought was only £10 which is half decent compared to forty quid , but if it makes money - why not good luck to him.

 

[Bluffer]

I've been taught to identify suitable resources and to make the components, but seeing as I would use a knife (Enzo Trapper if anyone was wondering) to fashion and shape the components, then I'd have no worries about buying a starter set.

Although it would end up like Triggers broom by the time you'd mastered the technique - 'I've had this same fire set for ten years, it's had two new bows, ten new cords, fifty new drills and a hundred new hearths'

 

[Uilleachan]

I don't see anything wrong with buying this kind of stuff. Trade is as old as people. As a kid I was obsessed with all things prehistoric particularly the mesolithic sites around me, Sand in Applecross and similar, possibly related, sites on Rassay and Skye.

I worked for a local family business as a scallop shucker and prawn sorter. One of my jobs was to take the scallop shells down to the shore to soak in the sea to allow the crabs to clean the shell prior to removal to land fill. I was up and down that piece of shore a couple of times a week for a few years.

A short while after moving on to a proper share fishing job an old ancient site visiting pal told me that a new guy to the glen had found an axe head on the very spot I'd been processing spent scallop shell. The guy said he was down looking at the shells to gather a few and it just caught his eye, Simon was this fellows name. Anyway, this turned out to be a rare example of an mesolithic axe head made from a rare black stone quarried from a specific site on the continent and this one of only a few such british examples. Could have found it's way there in any number of ways but this very sheltered sea loch is renowned for it's two salmon rivers, so there's a context for at least one possible scenario as to the presence of people who would have carries such tools, there's no natural flint anywhere near this spot either.

I'm luck enough to live in a place where I have access to lots of wood, not everyone is so fortunate. If you live in the middle of the city it's likely a lot less expensive to buy a kit for practice.

If trade in special items was good enough for our mesolithic and later ancestors, surely it's good enough for us.

 

[tim_n]

I took a couple of people out on the last 'core' day of the moot to find and make a set. Took about 2 hours and we had functioning kits - I had to run at that point to get home (I wonder how they got on!)

When we got back and people saw what we got, they asked 'why didn't you bring any to sell, I'd have bought one'

Which left me perplexed. I understand people on forums wanting one, or in urban areas wanting to practice. The idea of buying one with 300 acres of ancient woodland literally not on your doorstep but as your doorstep seemed a little silly and I'd be laughed out of the makers corner.

Saying that, I intend to make up a few kits for next year to put on the bring and buy table to raise money for various charities.

 

[Swallow]

Which left me perplexed. I understand people on forums wanting one, or in urban areas wanting to practice. The idea of buying one with 300 acres of ancient woodland literally not on your doorstep but as your doorstep seemed a little silly and I'd be laughed out of the makers corner.

Saying that, I intend to make up a few kits for next year to put on the bring and buy table to raise money for various charities.

Don't do it. No Charity is worth selling your soul for.

 

[tim_n]

Don't do it. No Charity is worth selling your soul for.

Don't see it as selling my soul

It only involves a walk and picking up some wood.

 

[Stringmaker]

If trade in special items was good enough for our mesolithic and later ancestors, surely it's good enough for us.

That is exactly how I feel.

When I run my sessions I show people limpet shells and stones with naturally worn dimples (not drilled) as bearings. If you were a pre-Roman person living inland you'd be very impressed with how much easier those two objects made things. Probably impressed enough to trade for one too.

I make the same point about flint, quartz and pyrite; you are at the mercy of the local geology unless somebody acquires some from somewhere else.

Supply and demand; it is as simple as that.

 

[Uilleachan]

That is exactly how I feel.

When I run my sessions I show people limpet shells and stones with naturally worn dimples (not drilled) as bearings. If you were a pre-Roman person living inland you'd be very impressed with how much easier those two objects made things. Probably impressed enough to trade for one too.

I make the same point about flint, quartz and pyrite; you are at the mercy of the local geology unless somebody acquires some from somewhere else.

Supply and demand; it is as simple as that.

Exactly, valued and specialist items are always tradable as very often it the only way to obtain them.

It rains a lot where I am, some years for months at a time. Between the end of november up and to the middle of february, when the sun gets high enough to provide an hour or two of slight warmth, the woods can be soaked right through, the only non wet anything is green wood. It would be tricky rocking up to look for a suitable hearth piece. I remember watching Ray on the TV a few years ago tackling this very issue, he cut then split a piece of fallen branch to get at the dry heart wood which he split to produce kindling, he used a fire steel to get it going mind although I dare say he could have used a bit for a base hearth.

I ventured out to the oak wood behind the house not long afterwards with a bushman & my log splitter one such february after a prolonged spell of big atlantic weather to have a look, nothing, even fairly beefy chunks, beefy enough to be quite an effort to cut, using the correct blade with the extra rakers, were soaked through. I lite a fire though kindled on birch bark flakes and fine birch twigs. Thats all there was on offer.

In such circumstances if you hadn't prepared one earlier you weren't going to find one, you'd be forced to use green wood, me, I spark it up with my zippo.

 

[Stringmaker]

Exactly, valued and specialist items are always tradable as very often it the only way to obtain them.

It rains a lot where I am, some years for months at a time. Between the end of november up and to the middle of february, when the sun gets high enough to provide an hour or two of slight warmth, the woods can be soaked right through, the only non wet anything is green wood. It would be tricky rocking up to look for a suitable hearth piece. I remember watching Ray on the TV a few years ago tackling this very issue, he cut then split a piece of fallen branch to get at the dry heart wood which he split to produce kindling, he used a fire steel to get it going mind although I dare say he could have used a bit for a base hearth.

I ventured out to the oak wood behind the house not long afterwards with a bushman & my log splitter one such february after a prolonged spell of big atlantic weather to have a look, nothing, even fairly beefy chunks, beefy enough to be quite an effort to cut, using the correct blade with the extra rakers, were soaked through. I lite a fire though kindled on birch bark flakes and fine birch twigs. Thats all there was on offer.

In such circumstances if you hadn't prepared one earlier you weren't going to find one, you'd be forced to use green wood, me, I spark it up with my zippo.

You raise another good point; that of preparation.

In a domestic, fixed base settlement, collecting tinder would be a part of the daily routine, as would cutting and shaping your friction fire kit and of course the large scale cutting and storing of fuel wood. I have a number of drills which I cut from green hazel coppice and just let dry out; likewise with bigger hearth boards. It is a whole lot easier to have your kit and fuel organised and dry, rather than forage for it.

Otzi the Iceman didn't rely on finding tinder as he went; he had it on him.

The only circumstance I can think of where you might have to rely on foraging is when the latest Viking raid had torched your village; then again you'd have embers on a mahooooosive scale to come back to!

Unless you can forage and prepare a complete bow drill set without using a modern knife or cordage then you still might just as well use a lighter or buy a kit.

 

[Clouston98]

Unless you can forage and prepare a complete bow drill set without using a modern knife or cordage then you still might just as well use a lighter or buy a kit.

That is very true because if you can't do it in a survival type situation with no cordage or knife then it is basically just a party trick. It is a great thing to learn how to do but not really viable without time, kit and the right weather conditions hence the reason why I am now into flint and steel firelighting and practice that.

 

[tim_n]

Unless you can forage and prepare a complete bow drill set without using a modern knife or cordage then you still might just as well use a lighter or buy a kit.

Totally agree - it's why I put off learning it so long until I could actually get a kit together myself.

 

[Stringmaker]

That is very true because if you can't do it in a survival type situation with no cordage or knife then it is basically just a party trick. It is a great thing to learn how to do but not really viable without time, kit and the right weather conditions hence the reason why I am now into flint and steel firelighting and practice that.

I run what are basically demonstration sessions, telling a bit of a story as I go back in time through various methods. I begin with a modern ferro-rod and vaseline soaked cotton wool, then flint and steel with charcloth, then friction (hand drill, pump drill and bow drill).

If I actually light a fire for real (maybe my chininea or fire bowl) then I'm not ashamed to admit to using wood shavings and a match.

 

[Stringmaker]

Totally agree - it's why I put off learning it so long until I could actually get a kit together myself.

Is anyone in touch with Chris A.K.A Lannyman?

It was his ultimate goal to just go into the woods with nothing and make a set.

 

[Swallow]

Is anyone in touch with Chris A.K.A Lannyman?

It was his ultimate goal to just go into the woods with nothing and make a set.

Like at 1:05:12 on here?

[video=youtube;6pFJPaCNFAA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pFJPaCNFAA&list=TLbGD cVKHEyJI[/video]

 

[Uilleachan]

You raise another good point; that of preparation.

In a domestic, fixed base settlement, collecting tinder would be a part of the daily routine, as would cutting and shaping your friction fire kit and of course the large scale cutting and storing of fuel wood. I have a number of drills which I cut from green hazel coppice and just let dry out; likewise with bigger hearth boards. It is a whole lot easier to have your kit and fuel organised and dry, rather than forage for it.

Otzi the Iceman didn't rely on finding tinder as he went; he had it on him.

The only circumstance I can think of where you might have to rely on foraging is when the latest Viking raid had torched your village; then again you'd have embers on a mahooooosive scale to come back to!

Unless you can forage and prepare a complete bow drill set without using a modern knife or cordage then you still might just as well use a lighter or buy a kit.

Yep, it's all about prep. These days I do a little round in the autumn when cutting hazel wands, off cuts and fallen wood I lay up in sheltered spots, over hangs under cuts and deer scrapes. As I do at home for my fire. I'm still running on oakum soaked in Stockholm tar as tinder, had my tinder tin for 30 years never really relied on it but I have it, in case of a future viking raid, or the dreaded zombie apocalypse, good to have when I can't find a light in the house, as happens occasionally.

 

[Stringmaker]

Like at 1:05:12 on here?

[video=youtube;6pFJPaCNFAA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pFJPaCNFAA&list=TLbGD cVKHEyJI[/video]

I can't see that from here (work) but I'll send the link home.

Thanks; I assume he cracked it!

 

[Firelite]

You raise another good point; that of preparation.

In a domestic, fixed base settlement, collecting tinder would be a part of the daily routine, as would cutting and shaping your friction fire kit and of course the large scale cutting and storing of fuel wood. I have a number of drills which I cut from green hazel coppice and just let dry out; likewise with bigger hearth boards. It is a whole lot easier to have your kit and fuel organised and dry, rather than forage for it.

Otzi the Iceman didn't rely on finding tinder as he went; he had it on him.

The only circumstance I can think of where you might have to rely on foraging is when the latest Viking raid had torched your village; then again you'd have embers on a mahooooosive scale to come back to!

Unless you can forage and prepare a complete bow drill set without using a modern knife or cordage then you still might just as well use a lighter or buy a kit.

Have I missed something here? From my reading of the thread after this comment you've almost all agreed that there is absolutely no merit in being able to make a bow drill set unless you make the cordage as well, and presumably either a flint blade or something to erode the set into shape. Is that really what you think? Is it so implausible that, god forbid, you needed to make a fire one day and the usual modern conveniences were not available, you might have a penknife and a shoelace? - or at least a shoelace? - or a piece off the bottom of your shirt? What happened to improvise, adapt, overcome? I'm not a prepper or survivalist, but I do believe there is merit in the bow drill.

Each to their own I suppose. In any event, I don't believe that the use of a bowdrill is beneficial just for its own sake alone. What about the experience that is gained in terms of technique for lighting fires in adverse circumstances? Or doing something for a challenge? Come on guys and gals, do we give up fishing and go to Tesco/Sainsbugs to buy our fish?; We all have perfectly good houses, so why go camping at all?
Am I being unreasonable?

 

[Stringmaker]

Have I missed something here? From my reading of the thread after this comment you've almost all agreed that there is absolutely no merit in being able to make a bow drill set unless you make the cordage as well, and presumably either a flint blade or something to erode the set into shape. Is that really what you think? Is it so implausible that, god forbid, you needed to make a fire one day and the usual modern conveniences were not available, you might have a penknife and a shoelace? - or at least a shoelace? - or a piece off the bottom of your shirt? What happened to improvise, adapt, overcome? I'm not a prepper or survivalist, but I do believe there is merit in the bow drill.

Each to their own I suppose. In any event, I don't believe that the use of a bowdrill is beneficial just for its own sake alone. What about the experience that is gained in terms of technique for lighting fires in adverse circumstances? Or doing something for a challenge? Come on guys and gals, do we give up fishing and go to Tesco/Sainsbugs to buy our fish?; We all have perfectly good houses, so why go camping at all?
Am I being unreasonable?

No you're not being unreasonable.

Maybe it didn't come across well in my posts but I personally regard the process by which I learnt this method as one of the most rewarding things I have ever done. It was a challenge, and involved much failure along the way but I am glad I did it. I regularly demonstrate the technique to non-bushy people and every time I do I stress the sophisticated engineering principles behind it. The fact that I have learnt and understood it gives me confidence that in a post-zombie world I probably could, eventually make a set and use it, but the real, genuine, life-threatening urgency to have to do it is extremely unlikely.

There are two distinctions:

The complete challenge of foraging the wood, using natural cordage and no modern blade.

Having a set ready to go (bought or not).

You make a good point about at least having a shoelace and being able to find a metal edge in extremis; maybe that is a more realistic context for learning the method. In fact, most of the time I show this I use an old pallet and a broom handle so that would fit nicely with the availability of "modern" resources to be able to use an ancient technique.

We're on the same side really; nobody who has learnt this method will begrudge a second of it.

 

[Firelite]

Phew. "..nobody who has learnt this method will begrudge a second of it." Spot on Stringmaker. It took me ages too, but I really believe all that experience of what didn't work was of benefit.

 

[Bluffer]

The longest journey begins with a small step.

Buying a pre-made set is about developing confidence and starting out under controlled conditions.