best suited natural cordage material for.......

[Man of Tanith]

I fancy making a prim tech fishing line/kit.
I can work out assorted hooks.
was wondering what the best natural cordage material would be?
nettle is suggested in a couple of books but I'm not sure if its "the best"
I've also had bramble suggested.

also I read somewhere about waterproofing the line using birch oil. is this worth doing as well?
(if so I shall knock up some easy enough)

look forward to folks input

 

[shaggystu]

Maybe Willow bark for the cordage Sam?
I'm pretty sure that Cedar bark was traditionally used in North America.

I'll be interested to see how you get on with this, I've been getting quite interested in fishing kit recently.

All the best,

Stuart.

 

[Toddy]

I'd use willow or lime bast meself.
Horsehair is the traditional braided fishing line though. Blooming hard on the fingers after about four metres I find.

Patrick might be the very man to ask.

atb,
Mary

 

[Man of Tanith]

I looked at Patricks stuff. elm seems t spring t mind?
hmmm finding the suggested ones may be tricksome for me will see what I can find. my permission is lacking in all of em but gives an excuse for a meander/dekko elsewhere.

made a simple fishing spear t'other week alas can't test it out.

 

[Man of Tanith]

Mary-horse hair as in tail hair?

 

[Toddy]

uhuh but not from mares. They piddle through the hair and it's supposed to weaken it. You're looking for white if you can get it.

Come to think on it; I came across a link for someone selling it by the bag load in the UK not so long ago
No idea what I did with the link though If I come across it, I'll send it to you Sam.

atb,
M

 

[Toddy]

Something like this Sam.
http://horsehairextensions.com/18-inch-loose-horse-hair

It'll cost you though. Maybe ask if anyone on the forum keeps horses ? That's how I got the hair last time I made the braid.

atb,
M

 

[cranmere]

What sort of braid do you make?

 

[Toddy]

Horsehair braid is plaited, or it's twisted in sections that are then knotted together...that's much quicker to make but not as strong. I round braided mine. I started with 12 strands divided into four, and plaited that for so many metres (PatrickM makes 30 foot at that gauge, I think mine works out about 2m ) then taper it down to eight strands and then down to four and finally to one. If you do a three part flat plait, it goes 12, 9, 6, 3.
It's virtually invisible to fish if you do it with white-ish hair. That said, the dark stuff 'seems' to work well too.
Depends how you intend to use it I suppose.
I'm allergic to fish, I just made the line because I could

Interested to see how Sam gets on with it

M

 

[cranmere]

Thanks for such detailed info Toddy.

 

[Man of Tanith]

that makes two.of us Mary.
tis an idea at moment see what occours

 

[Toddy]

It's finicky, but kind of satisfying when you look along it and it's sound Then you see someone like Patrick's work and it's a hmmm sort of moment :/
I think if someone has the patience to tie those miniscule fishing flies with single strands of wool and the like, then they'd be well able to make the line.

M

 

[wattsy]

could you not use flax?

 

[Quixoticgeek]

Horsehair braid is plaited, or it's twisted in sections that are then knotted together...that's much quicker to make but not as strong. I round braided mine. I started with 12 strands divided into four, and plaited that for so many metres (PatrickM makes 30 foot at that gauge, I think mine works out about 2m ) then taper it down to eight strands and then down to four and finally to one. If you do a three part flat plait, it goes 12, 9, 6, 3.
It's virtually invisible to fish if you do it with white-ish hair. That said, the dark stuff 'seems' to work well too.
Depends how you intend to use it I suppose.

Does horse tail hair like this have strikingly different properties to human hair?

Julia

 

[Toddy]

I tried, my hair is waist long, and so it Son1's. Horsehair doesn't twist as our hair does, it stays almost like long catwhiskers. It's smoother (except where the mare piddles through it and it raises the wee tiny scales on the hair) than our hair, it's tougher, it's not stretchy the way ours is when it's wet. Try soaking one of your own hairs and pulling it, it'll stretch a fair bit. I can stretch mine a couple of inches when it's wet, and it's not just the curly bits straightening out. It means that when it's wet and under tension, and then dries out, the ends of the plaiting or the twisting don't spring out and make a jaggy mess of the line.

There's a kind of braiding done for camel harnesses in Rajasthan called Ply Split braiding. It used to be done with horsehair braids, and it's beautiful work Mostly they use goat hair and cotton now though.
Modern weavers use various materials for their braids. Peter Collingwood, who was the most interesting man to talk with wrote the first book on the topic.....somewhere I have a signed copy and a tshirt with the logo about splitting hairs.
http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=pl...dia.org%2Fwiki%2FPly-split_braiding;2592;1944

Otherwise I only know of horsehair being used for bracelets, for strings for instruments, for fly whisks, and for flat matting weaving. It doesn't fold/wrap around tightly, iimmc, it gently bends.

Sorry for the ramble of a reply Having a coffee break since I got rained off in the garden, again

atb,
M

 

[Quixoticgeek]

I tried, my hair is waist long, and so it Son1's.

That is where my thoughts went, my hair is 30" long, just a couple of inches off being able to sit on it.

J

 

[Toddy]

Mine's not that long nowadays. I used to be able to sit on it, but it was a right royal pain to deal with when I was swimming every day.

You could try keeping your combings for a few days and having a go at the cordage with it. I managed fine braids but it was awkward to join in lengths. It was hard to keep an even tension on it, even when I tried oiling it down a bit to stop the static.
Might just be my hair, because I know that human hair belts/waistbands, were/are woven. Many are of ritual significance though; the belt is the first 'garment' and it's still seen as somehow embueing human-ness as opposed to bestial-ness in some cultures. Those made of human hair were considered powerful/ talismanic.
I made wristbands from mine.

There was a girl at University who had a braid that hung just above her ankles. It looked almost like a tail hanging down below her coat

atb,
M

 

[Quixoticgeek]

Mine's not that long nowadays. I used to be able to sit on it, but it was a right royal pain to deal with when I was swimming every day.

You could try keeping your combings for a few days and having a go at the cordage with it. I managed fine braids but it was awkward to join in lengths. It was hard to keep an even tension on it, even when I tried oiling it down a bit to stop the static.
Might just be my hair, because I know that human hair belts/waistbands, were/are woven. Many are of ritual significance though; the belt is the first 'garment' and it's still seen as somehow embueing human-ness as opposed to bestial-ness in some cultures. Those made of human hair were considered powerful/ talismanic.
I made wristbands from mine.

Have tried this in the past, alas, the amount of conditioner I use on it means that it makes really poor cord when I've tried to spin some together. Which is a shame, given how much comes out when I brush every day.

There was a girl at University who had a braid that hung just above her ankles. It looked almost like a tail hanging down below her coat

Sounds amazing. I set out with the aim of getting "waist length hair". Now it's passed my natural waist and touches the belt on my jeans. I love it, even if I do sometimes have obsessive compulsive hair brushing sometimes. I'll probably trim it at the point where it's at risk of getting caught in my back side...

Does mean I have to be careful, had issues with an ex where by only one of us could sleep with our hair down, else we would wake up with a tangled together...

But we digress from the original topic.

Julia