Silver Birch Sap

[SoloBoy]

Could anybody tell me where im going wrong here guys? Went to a little wood at the bottom of my dads garden(dont worry he owns the land)and tried to drain the sap out of a couple of Silver Birch trees,but to no avail.I drilled a hole at the base of the tree approx 10mm thick and 3-4 inches deep,left it overnight like my mate Ray did,but next morning found my bowl to be empty :sadwavey: Inserted to the hole was A piece of small tube which easily could have collected the sap.
What am I doing wrong? The tree was roughly 1 foot in circumfrence.
P.S, I did plug them afterwards aswell

 

[Ahjno]

Two options:

1. You can't tap a Silver Birch (don't know that - maybe someone else can shine a light? - But with my simple uni logic: a birch is a birch ... And a Silver Birch is a birch ).
2. You're a wee bit to early with tapping the tree, see this thread:
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/community/showthread.php?t=11122&page=2&pp=1

 

[Laurence Dell]

I would agree a bit too early
What part of the country are you in?

I would also say that you drilled the holes too deep, you didn't push the pipe all the way in did you? that might of blocked the flow of sap :11doh: you see the sap flows from the cambium layer just under the bark 3-4 inches would be right into the heartwood

 

[pierre girard]

I would agree a bit too early
What part of the country are you in?

I would also say that you drilled the holes too deep, you didn't push the pipe all the way in did you? that might of blocked the flow of sap :11doh: you see the sap flows from the cambium layer just under the bark 3-4 inches would be right into the heartwood

Holes should be drilled between 1 1/2 inch and three inches deep. Hole should drilled straight in and should be about three feet off the ground and in a line between the largest root and the largest branch. Early in the season, south side of the tree is best. Holes drilled only a few inches apart will show a marked difference in flow.

Spiles (tubes) need to be tapered. The tapered spile seals the hole at the outside of the hole. The hole itself acts as a resevoir, collecting the sap which is drained by the spile.

Here is an example of some manufactured spiles on e-bay. Note the tapered ends:

http://cgi.ebay.com/MAPLE-sugar-SYR...oryZ1269QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Similar spiles can easily be constructed of wood.

PG

 

[Toddy]

Does anybody know of a UK supplier of this type of spile? Before we plead with PG to organise a group buy

Cheers,
Toddy

 

[Ed]

Not sure where to get one of those from

But as an alternative..... any good homebrew supplier should be able to provide you with a brewers spile and tap, the type used on traditional wooden barrels. They can still be bought made from wood, allowing you to cut them down and reshape them if you see fit.


Ed

 

[Toddy]

Now that's a good idea Ed
I've got a friendly homebrew shop owner that I might just pester and see what he can come up with

Cheers,
Toddy

 

[bambodoggy]

I would agree a bit too early
What part of the country are you in?

I would also say that you drilled the holes too deep, you didn't push the pipe all the way in did you? that might of blocked the flow of sap :11doh: you see the sap flows from the cambium layer just under the bark 3-4 inches would be right into the heartwood

My thoughts exactly on both counts

Too deep with the drill and up in Liverpool I'd say you're a week or so early....it's only just starting to flow down here in sunny surrey

Bam.

 

[SoloBoy]

As usual guys,top notch help,thank you.
My holes were drilled a bit too deep I think but what I was using as A piece of trunking without the lid,so should have a natural flow to the jerry eg..http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Main_Index/Trunking_Pvc_Index/MiniTrunking_Network/index.html
So this shouldnt have blocked the flow laurence,(what do you think of the improv? )
At about 1 foot of the ground. And I think Ive got loads to go on now,cheers for the thread Ahjno,will let all no how it goes.
By the way how do we upload pictures to the forum for future ref,cant see an attachement icon,or am I looking too hard. :yikes:

 

[Ahjno]

As usual guys,top notch help,thank you.
My holes were drilled a bit too deep I think but what I was using as A piece of trunking without the lid,so should have a natural flow to the jerry eg..http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Main_Index/Trunking_Pvc_Index/MiniTrunking_Network/index.html
So this shouldnt have blocked the flow laurence,(what do you think of the improv? )
At about 1 foot of the ground. And I think Ive got loads to go on now,cheers for the thread Ahjno,will let all no how it goes.
By the way how do we upload pictures to the forum for future ref,cant see an attachement icon,or am I looking too hard. :yikes:

You can't - to upload a pic to the forum (gallery) you need to be a full member (to subscribe: see Big Blue Button on the Bottom wee Below). You can however upload a pic to a host site (something like www.photobucket.com) and post the link from your pic on BCUK, so we can all see it.

An how-to-post-a-piccie tutorial made by Scanker:
http://www.bushcraftuk.com/community/showpost.php?p=135609&postcount=5

... Now ... where did I post that link before in the last 3 days ...

 

[match]

I'd also agree - its still too early to be drilling - I won't be trying in Edinburgh for at least another fortnight, unless it warms up significantly in the near future.

As to drilling, I'd say drill about 4-6 inches into the tree - in fact, when I drill I drill an inch or two, at a time and stop - when you hit the right depth you stop gettin sawdust and start gettin a sludgy wood pulp coming out, followed by running sap within 30 seconds to a minute. Most people think of sap as oozing out, but it does drip quite fast, and you can get up to 2 litres in under 24 hours when the sap is running fully.

As to collecting it, last time I went for minimum equipment - drilled hole with hand drill and got plastic flexible siphon tube from brewing shop that was a couple of mm bigger than drill bit. Forced this into the hole so it wedged well, but only an inch or so in so as to not block the sap flow, and then stuck the other end into 2l fizzy drinks bottles. Simple and effective, and easy to transport if your trees aren't nearby... When finished, I took used wine bottle corks, shaped these to fit the hole and hammered them in. When I last looked these should be good to just pull out with a corkscrew, re-drill the hole to remove any set sap/new growth, and re-tap this time round.

 

[pierre girard]

Does anybody know of a UK supplier of this type of spile? Before we plead with PG to organise a group buy

Cheers,
Toddy

Toddy:

Take a piece of dowel about 3 1/2 inch long by about 5/8 inch. Drill 1/8 inch hole lengthwise. Taper dowel on stationary circular sander down to about 1/4 inch on small end and taper would be half, or more, of the total length of the dowel. Wrap wire around dowel for hanging bucket. You can make a dozen in an hour.

I have a few of the commercial ones, but as they are easily lost, I replace them with those made from dowel (actually, I most often use sumac cut in the forest, but dowel works fine too).

I really can't emphasize strongly enough the importance of the taper to get the maximum flow. Some of my maple sap buckets (two and a half gallons) are over full every day when sap is flowing best. This is only from the best trees however.

PG

 

[Biddlesby]

How do you know when the sap is ready to tap, or is it just intuition? I'm in Norfolk.

 

[weekend_warrior]

How do you know when the sap is ready to tap, or is it just intuition? I'm in Norfolk.

Don't you have intuition in Norfolk then?

When the green buds just start to unfurl, is what I was told by me grandpa (a Norfolk boy all his life.)

 

[pierre girard]

How do you know when the sap is ready to tap, or is it just intuition? I'm in Norfolk.

Don't know for England. Locally, sap runs about the end of March when days are above freezing and nights are below freezing. It has come in February some years. When days and nights are above freezing sap starts to go "milky" and produces much poorer tasting syrup.

PG

 

[pierre girard]

Best Trees:

A good tree really makes a difference. A tree with a large crown will put out a lot more sap than one with a small crown. A friend taps five trees, with large crowns, in his yard and gets as much sap as I do from 50 trees, with small crowns, in the forest.

PG

 

[Toddy]

Toddy:
.......
Take a piece of dowel about 3 1/2 inch long by about 5/8 inch. Drill 1/8 inch hole lengthwise. Taper dowel on stationary circular sander down to about 1/4 inch on small end and taper would be half, or more, of the total length of the dowel. Wrap wire around dowel for hanging bucket. You can make a dozen in an hour.
.....

PG

Thanks PG; I might give that a go though normally I just do as Match does and use minimal equipment. There are three large silver birches just outside my back fence along the burn path and if I can use something inconspicuous so much the better. I did fancy having a 'proper' spile, though I have used an elder tube before now for it and it worked very well.

Cheers,
Toddy

 

[pierre girard]

Does anybody know of a UK supplier of this type of spile? Before we plead with PG to organise a group buy

Cheers,
Toddy

Be glad to do it, if you really want some, but it is probably too late for this year. The suppliers of these items are notoriously slow on delivery. I believe the price is somewhere around $2 per spile (have to check my catalog). They've come out with some stainless steel ones the past few years and that is what I'd probably buy - if I were going to buy some. They also have aluminum and plastic. Both of these require more care and the plastic requires tubing and a plastic bag set up. Plastic bags are great - if you like to feed marten, racoon, and mink, and don't mind doing a lot of work for nothing.

PG

 

[Mad Mike]

What size of tree do people use ( Trunk diameter )

wouldn't want to use a tree too small

 

[Toddy]

Be glad to do it, if you really want some, but it is probably too late for this year. The suppliers of these items are notoriously slow on delivery. I believe the price is somewhere around $2 per spile (have to check my catalog). They've come out with some stainless steel ones the past few years and that is what I'd probably buy - if I were going to buy some. They also have aluminum and plastic. Both of these require more care and the plastic requires tubing and a plastic bag set up. Plastic bags are great - if you like to feed marten, racoon, and mink, and don't mind doing a lot of work for nothing.

PG

Seriously Pierre Girard, we might very well like to go ahead with this. It's probably too late for this year to actually use them, but if we got them here in good time for next season it would be good.
With that in mind, lets clarify things a little, shall we?

1] Does anyone know of a UK supplier? and, if so, at what price?

2] How many of us would be interested in spiles anyway?


Cheers,
Toddy