Saxon felling axe - maker?

[Rhodri]

Hi All,

I realise I should probably post this on BB as well, but I'll start here first.

I'm thinking of having an axe made and was wondering if anybody out there knew someone willing/able to do it.

I'd like to commission a Saxon felling axe to use for some general bushcraft tasks. It was after all, along with the broad axe, the main part of the basic Saxon woodworker's tool kit and was probably used for everything we do - and a lot more besides.

I've looked around various re-enactment suppliers and they seem preoccupied with weapons that you pretend to hit people with. I want a tool that I can hit things with. Mind you, having watched a few re-enactors in action the word 'pretend' is used above with advisement...

I'm still researching the dimensions and design but it's something along the lines of the one found in the Hurbuck Hoard which can be seen here, I believe (third axehead from the left)...

http://www.thebritishmuseum.ac.uk/c...ll/lg&_IXimg=k59052.jpg&submit-button=summary

Dimensions are about:
Blade width = 6cm (narrowing to about 3cm)
Blade length = 15cm
Handle/helve = ?60cm (I'm making this up a bit the wooden bits don't tend to survive )

Any ideas or contacts?

Thanks,
Rod

 

[scruff]

which one is it?

4th from bottom? on right-hand side?

if so its very similar to british belt/trade axe. i believe they were derived from this old saxon/ viking type belt axe.

GB do a belt axe, is it of similar design to this? this place does 'em an also a farmers cross axe which is a felling type axe

http://www.wealddown.co.uk/gransfors-bruks-axes-ancient-collection.htm

 

[Gary]

Rod, I have just bought a hand forged tomahawk modelled on the British trade axe used and traded with native americans all along the american frontier in the 1800's and before - not a cheap toy, mine is a user, but really impressive it way out performs my old SFA. this was made by GB's master axe smith.

They do several other historical models too but again they are expensive that said very worth a look.

 

[scruff]

OK the site is very budget but it may be worth enquiring here (www.whiterosearmoury.co.uk) for a custom order.

i've seen this guy produce 'live' swords on the telly (on time team i think) in the traditional saxon/ viking methods....i bet he's turned his hand to axe heads before.

it says best to email

White Rose Armoury:- area59@armouries.fsnet.co.uk

 

[scruff]

gary -> nice

i wish i could justify spending the pennies on one!

its what i could really do with.

 

[Rhodri]

Thanks Scruff,

which one is it?

4th from bottom? on right-hand side?

if so its very similar to british belt/trade axe. i believe they were derived from this old saxon/ viking type belt axe.

Yep, that's the one. Does look similar but I think I'm going to be a anal about the dimensions and go for a commission rather than buy something ready-made, no matter how similar. I'll definitely try a couple of the armourers I've found, including the one you sent a link to - just to see what they'll say.

And Gary,

How do you find your new (and very nice) one for heavy work? We (I've just put my archaeologists hat on and am using the 'royal' we...) know that they used these things for felling and limbing pretty big stuff. How do you find it compares? It might be slightly easier to use a bigger, heavier axe but if you're doing it all day every day and you had the skill (as they did)...

Rod

 

[Gary]

Rhodri,

I've only had her a few days and thus far have only done with her the typical bushcraft things - namely carving - all of which I would say as she is lighter than a SFA she is excellent for, safer and more controlled.

I have split a few rounds and again no worries there, same axemanship prinicples as usaul really.

As for felling and limbing, I guess I will have to wait until the next course we run in Sweden to test that out as we fell (and teach the correct method!) a few trees on that course firstly for making good maya sticks and then for building proper winter lean too shelters so I'll have to get back to you especially on the prolonged use bit.

That said I'll drop, and limb, a big old rhoddy (not a tree but a lot of work none the less) I know of this weekend and we will see how she fares there!

 

[Lord Farquhar]

try asking Tacol over on british blades he is a very good smith and had done axes etc before

 

[tomtom]

lets see some pictures then Gary!

 

[Doc]

Very interesting to hear of the GB trade tomahawk type axes. Ray's book shows the 'Woodlore Tomahawk' which looks like a typical straight handled trade tomahawk, but in 'Bushcraft' he only refers to GB axes.

Cold Steel make a reasonably priced Tomahawk but a review http://www.physics.mun.ca/~sstamp/knives/norse.html
is not too flattering. Apparently it sticks and is just not as good as the GB wildlife hatchet.

I like the traditional idea of the tomahawk/trade axe (accepting that originally tomahawks would have a stone blade) but did wonder how they compared to a similar size hatchet/axe in real life.

The reviewer above tried throwing his 'hawk with some success and I suppose this might be a diverting sport, but on the other hand for bushcraft purposes you want people to be clear that it is a woodcraft tool and not a weapon.

 

[swamp donkey]

It depends on how much money you want to spend. There is a fantastic smith down Sussex way by the name of Hector Cole (I think he has a web site) He had seaxes on his stand the last time I saw him before Christmas last.
There is also a smith who usually attends the Carpenters Fellowship "Frame" event which is usually early Sept see there web site for details

Swamp Donkey

 

[Gary]

lets see some pictures then Gary!

My digi cam died of frost bite in Norway Tom so I will need to wait til either the next ashdown meet up or the next country fair I do to get a picture mate.

Doc, problem with a hawk (especially the french model which hails from the fransisca) is that it was a weapon as much as a tool!

I have the cold steel rifleman and it is a good throwing axe although a little to heavy for bushcraft work. The GB one seems to offer the best of both worlds but then there is the cost.

As with all things me and my team are trialing these and if we think they offer a good bushcrafting as well as authentic woodsman like alternative I'll let you know! So far they get a big thumbs up and being hand forged they ouzzzzeeee class!

 

[Paganwolf]

i have the french trade axe and have been carving and shaving feather sticks ect with it and find it a dream to use, the sheath its supplied with (even though it states no sheath supplied) is poney and need modification, i have also taken a tad from the handle length but thats personal preference, its a dream to use believe me ill get some pics up for ye the axe is of a perfect weight and size for me, as for felling in the uk the chances you are going to fell a full sizetree is remote to say the least, but its a perfect size for sorting out wrist thick sweet chestnut/willow ect which is more like a normal bushcrafty type task..

 

[Rhodri]

Hi Paganwolf,

...as for felling in the uk the chances you are going to fell a full sizetree is remote to say the least, but its a perfect size for sorting out wrist thick sweet chestnut/willow ect...

The Saxons did it routinely - I've dug up some of their handiwork. Perhaps they had a high tolerance for blisters ... Or just took their time... Or were fitter... Or were just better at it...

Don't know - that's why I want to try a replica of their most common tool.

Cheers,
Rod

 

[Paganwolf]

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[Paganwolf]

Hi Paganwolf,



The Saxons did it routinely - I've dug up some of their handiwork. Perhaps they had a high tolerance for blisters ... Or just took their time... Or were fitter... Or were just better at it...

Don't know - that's why I want to try a replica of their most common tool.

Cheers,
Rod

fairy nuff buddy, id be the same i just ment for general bushcrafty uk stuff, shelters,fire,carving ect you did say general bushcrafty stuff, looking forward to seing your prize axe though you cant beat a hand made personal axe..

 

[Gary]

Hi Paganwolf,



The Saxons did it routinely - I've dug up some of their handiwork. Perhaps they had a high tolerance for blisters ... Or just took their time... Or were fitter... Or were just better at it...

Don't know - that's why I want to try a replica of their most common tool.

Cheers,
Rod

Rod I am sure all native peoples no matter what period they lived in felled trees using whatever tool was at hand - Robert Rogers made a whole raft by burning down trees - never underestimate mans ability!!

But for general bushcraft in this country it would be considerd a no no to fell trees on most occasions - thats one of the reason we go to Sweden for example so we can learn and practice this skill - but again it would be wrong to suggest or put the idea in peoples heads that they should do so in this country where doing so could lead to criminal prosecution and if carried out badly or carelessly scared and infected woodlands.

 

[Rhodri]

.............................

Oops. Sorry didn't mean it to sound that abrupt. No offence? Electronic communication might be a "marvel of the modern age" (or something like that), but I do like to look 'em in the eye - people know what your on about then...

BTW when I say felling I probably don't mean huge stuff, but I've found split planks that have come from about 30cm ish trees quite commonly. They had to get 'em down somehow...

Cheers,
Rod

 

[Doc]

Thanks for the info Gary.

There is a lot of history behind the tomahawk and perhaps this explains all this interest. I like the idea of using traditional kit but truth be told in many areas modern kit is superior - for example a modern plastic gold pan with moulded riffles is a superior mining tool to the steel ones used a century ago in the Yukon gold rush.

All very interesting. Perhaps the next meet will look like a scene from 'Last of the Mohicans' - which incidentally is a great film and a good read as a book.

Paganwolf - look forward to the pics of the French trade axe.

 

[Gary]

Thanks for the info Gary.

All very interesting. Perhaps the next meet will look like a scene from 'Last of the Mohicans' - which incidentally is a great film and a good read as a book.

Paganwolf - look forward to the pics of the French trade axe.

We are working on it Doc believe me!