Options and ideas for big bag / small bag systems

[C_Claycomb]

Day bags.

So, you are on a trip, hiking, canoeing, vehicle, flying, how do you split, organise and carry your gear.

I am trying to work out whether my interest in piggy-back / detachable day bags and the like makes sense and what other people think.
Here are my experiences that brought this aspect of kit carrying to my mind:

• Hiking/fishing in Norway. Main bag was a Sabre 60-100. We hiked in, set up camp in a place for a couple of nights while we fished and explored the local area, then packed up and moved to anew place. These "local" walks could be loops of eight to 15km through trackless forest and mountain terrain.
• Canoe expeditions, Scotland, Norway, and Sweden; main bag is packed hard into the middle of the canoe, wedged between blue barrels and underneath bulky gear such as saws, tripods, and spare paddles.
• Vehicle travel in general is similar. Main bags in the back of a 4x4, or the hold of an aircraft.

In all cases I have found it useful to have a smaller bag in which to store raingear, food, water, camera/binos, navigation aids, etc. which can be easily carried or accessed while the main bag is used to store gear at camp or is otherwise inaccessible.

Do other people encounter this, and if so, how do you pack your kit?

Solutions I have seen:

1. Main bag does not need to be shouldered often as in vehicle travel, so the small bag can be a smaller backpack without clashing with the main bag. Main bag might be a duffle of some sort.
2. "Travel " bags come with piggy-back day packs. Never actually see anyone using one of these, only seen in shops.
3. British Army PLCE side pockets and yoke. Sort of a military version of (ii), this has been my chosen method for a number of trips.
4. Pack top lid doubles as shoulder bag. I have this with my Kifaru Zulu and XTL lid. Nice, but easy to overload the lid as a shoulder bag and there is always a compromise, either the lid isn't perfect as a bag, or a bag isn't perfect for a lid.
5. Main pack contents disgorged into tent/dry-bag at camp and used cinched down as a day bag (only feasible for instance 1 above). Don't like this myself since decanting gear risks losing things and none of my bigger bags cinches down satisfactorily. The Zulu/XTL needs quite a lot of stuffing to carry properly.

Do you use one of these? Are you happy with it, or do you think it could be improved upon?

I am thinking I would like to explore a variation on the PLCE system since it will work with my Zulu, was wondering if it would be popular enough to make more than one, but before investing time and money I thought I would see what folk here think and find out how they carry day gear. I could be thinking of a solution that lacks a problem

 

[Man of Tanith]

I use an oilcloth haversack as the small bag option.
Rolls up tiny. Enough space for day essentials bar spare jumper

 

[Toddy]

I can't be the only one who looks at modern rucksacks and thinks that some of them are the heaviest part of the kit.
We managed with nylon stuff sacks when I was a teenager. They might not have been brilliant but they weighed almost nothing.

Sorry Chris taken it OT.

M

 

[mountainm]

I use a home made net on an old rucksack frame to stash stuffsacks and drybags in.

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[bearbait]

I bought myself a Lowe Alpine pack thats dimensions generally fit the criteria for airline carry-on baggage. So big pack and/or kit bag go as checked baggage and my Lowe Alpine day sack is carry-on so no need to waste checked baggage space with it. The day sack is easily capable of any day hike (of mine), including down to -degrees and carrying snowshoes.

Also I wear my hiking boots when I fly. That way they're not taking up loads of space and weight in my checked baggage. As soon as I'm on the plane I take them off and sit in my sox. (I do slip into the boots when I make use of the comfort-break facility on the aircraft.)

 

[Man of Tanith]

I use a home made net on an old rucksack frame to stash stuffsacks and drybags in.

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You got a pic of that mate?

 

[mountainm]

You got a pic of that mate?

http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=127523&page=2

 

[mountainm]

Lol you even commented on it!

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[Corso]

hillpeoplegear.com, not cheap though

 

[Man of Tanith]

Lol you even commented on it!

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I have the memory of a baffled hamster mate.
If i didnt get cold feet lid forget t put socks on somedays

 

[Jared]

Crib Gogh has modular packs, like this one

http://www.cribgogh.com/?p=128

Starts as a 35L day pack, and then has addons to take it over 100L. But it seems to me the opposite of what would make a good pack in this situation.
Using the 35L for the EDC stuff, that means all the big and bulky would have to go into the addon pouches.

 

[Squidders]

I haven't needed the big bag, small bag combination combination but I'd likely go for a north face basecamp duffle and a golite jam as the basecamp duffle is bomb proof and the jam is light weight, very functional and packable.

 

[Rabid]

I use a PLCE bergan with a small daysack that is stored under the top cover of the bergan when not being used. best of both worlds.
I never unpack the daysack so as soon as I take my bergan off I can put on my daysack and continue should I need to.

 

[oldtimer]

I've wrestled with this for years. For a long time I used to carry a nylon stuff sack with improvised shoulder straps for day gear. Then I tried a haver sack. Then switched to a fanny pack with essential kit which went into the main sack and could then be taken on side trips. The problem was it wasn't big enough to take waterproofs. I also got a fright when I didn't fasten the single belt buckle properly and watched all my emergency gear tumble down a Pyreneean hillside fortunately stopped by a well placed bush.

Last year my younger son bought me a Tesco daysack. This is very light and has a main and two other pockets. It takes emergency and day kit and goes complete into my main sack. The system works well. The only downside is reduced access to those things you need in a hurry while on the move when it's in the main sack. Although I find I can access things more easily than from the fanny pack when used as a daysack as it slips off easily. It is also possible to wear it on the front like a Ribz rig. I'm also not sure about durability but so far, so good.

 

[sandbender]

"...Pack top lid doubles as shoulder bag. I have this with my Kifaru Zulu and XTL lid. Nice, but easy to overload the lid as a shoulder bag and there is always a compromise, either the lid isn't perfect as a bag, or a bag isn't perfect for a lid..."

For some of my longer walks in further away places I tried to cut weight to a minimum. My chosen pack was the lightweight and nigh on indestructible Crux AK47 the top pocket of which could be removed. I would use that as both my carry on luggage for the flight and as a shoulder bag for when I wandered away from camp or was in a town and wanted to go shop or eat.

For canoeing trips I liked the Karrimor rucksack with rocket pouches as they could be broken down to fit in barrels or Ortlieb bags and yet the rucksack components would still keep my gear dry and clean when pulled out at the end of the day.

The other advantage with Karrimor packs designed for rocket pouches is that you can zip the main pack zips together and turn your 45 litre (or more) pack into a 25 litre day sack.

As a final thought, I have also used a small cuboid camera bag (Lowepro Stealth 100) as a front pouch with the Karrimor, hooking it on the front of the rucksack straps with small karabiners, this lets me access maps, compass, notebook and camera gear without taking my pack off, balances the load a bit and the camera bag becomes a shoulder bag for heading to a bar or shops or whatever.

I hope this helps.

"...I also got a fright when I didn't fasten the single belt buckle properly and watched all my emergency gear tumble down a Pyreneean hillside..."

I once unbuckled mine while enjoying the moonlight on remote bit of coastline in Greece, I then walked another five kilometres before realising that I'd left it behind.

 

[lathe dog]

The Osprey Aether 70 has been my main large pack for the last 2-3 years which you can piggy back the smaller 13L Daylite pack to making an 80+ litre, also with the Aether you get a removable top lid pocket with its own stowaway waist belt. Its not a lightweight option by any means but the main pack is a comfortable carry and has an excellent compression strap system.

 

[C_Claycomb]

Some great into here, thanks chaps.

Mary,
Yes, every time I come home and empty my big bag I think I MUST have left something in it...like an axe or full water bottle, even when its empty. I have nearly all my gear weighed out and the weight of the packs when considering going somewhere by air is always a concern. I do like having the functionality when I get there though. Tried the hand held stuff sack route once...never again.

Jared,
Hadn't seen Crib Gogh stuff. Interesting. Nice seeing something like that from the UK. So much of the interesting carrying gear is from elsewhere. Not sure I like what I understand their design to be though. It looks like their packs have expansion gussets, which means that although they might compress well, you are carrying a lot of fabric weight for a given bag. The Sabre 60-100 was like that, had a big zip around the sides, but it weighed a ton and a half! If you only wanted 60lt you were still carrying 100lts worth of 1000D Cordura

It was my experience with that pack that had me looking at Kifaru and ultimately buying a third hand Gen1 Zulu. Not such a big pack, but able to have more storage added to the outside. Its still heavier than I want, with all that MOLLE and double layer 1000D to create slot pockets on the outside, but it is bombproof. I got my pack from Stuart, who had had it second hand before taking it trekking in Namibia and on two or three trips into the jungle in Borneo. Looked pretty good when I got it, and six rather less adventurous trips of my own haven't troubled it a bit.

I really liked the PLCE rocket pockets, which could also be attached to the Zulu and were better than the stupidly heavy and undersized things that Kifaru sold, but I didn't like the yoke, nor that the pockets were made of 1000D material which made them heavier and bulkier than I thought they needed to be.

So, I made a pair of 500D pockets that work with the Kifaru accessory straps and can be joined together with an organiser pouch to make a 20+ litre lower-back pack. I think I like the idea, but my attempt at pack making leaves some things to be desired. They roll up really small when not in use, but lack shape unless they are packed full.

Not sure whether I want to sink time into refining these or not. Especially if there is a ready made solution out there Its that time&money vs money thing

Still wanting to hear form anyone else who uses a two bag system, or has a one-bag system that does it all!!

Cheers

 

[Quixoticgeek]

I used to use PLCE side pockets on a Berghaus vulcan pack, but I've moved away from that setup as it's just far far far too heavy. I have moved to an Exped Lightning 60 pack, with Flash pocket. This gives me plenty of space for what I need. I could take the flash pocket off and rig up some shoulder straps, but I'm actually thinking of using an Exped cloudburst 15 or 25 as a day pack. It may not quite have the elegance of the PLCE side pocket setup, but I could carry the whole lot twice for the weight of the Vulcan.

J

 

[Jared]

Just wondering whether PCLE pouches would attach/zip to the KarrimorSF Tecmac when the main compartment is removed.

https://youtu.be/qQmgIYh8vOY?t=5m59s

 

[SCOMAN]

Did you think of getting a Kifaru E&E it's specifically designed to be piggybacked. It's a nice little back on it's own.