What's the point of guns? Please don't read if squeamish

[Matt.S]

naah, i don't think so. people generally respect hunters. nothing the state says or does is going to change that.

anyhow, anyone who's gonna have a go at you for hunting with a gun better make damn sure they're a vegetarian or they're just a hypocrite.

i've never heard of anyone having their house burned down for shooting pheasants

I don't think that hunting is in the public eye enough for the general public to think about it much at all. I don't think that the public as a rule respects hunters at all; poor Bambi, that man's got a gun etc. Many people think of hunters as a bunch of men with an inferiority complex that are just out to kill everything that moves and mount its head on the wall. That or very rich tweedy types with a matched pair of Purdys, a Range Rover and a pile of various gamebirds.

Did you see what the riot police did to the Countryside Alliance protesters a couple of years ago? Horseback hunts being harassed and disrupted, with members of the Hunt being threatened and their responses recorded and edited in very clever ways so it makes them seem at fault? Hunt staff being stalked? How about what happens to employees of companies that provide animals for vivisection?

 

[humblebumble]

Did you see what the riot police did to the Countryside Alliance protesters a couple of years ago? Horseback hunts being harassed and disrupted, with members of the Hunt being threatened and their responses recorded and edited in very clever ways so it makes them seem at fault? Hunt staff being stalked? How about what happens to employees of companies that provide animals for vivisection?

as far as the police go, they treat everyone that protests like that, rich or poor, right or left, violent or peaceful. you have no right to free assembly and protest. i can personally testify to that, as no doubt can many of the CA

as for the rest of it, i'm determined never to get involved in politics on this forum. and we're probably getting a bit off topic anyway.

if you have to kill a beastie, do it properly. i thank those who have given me advice. and if i pull a rabbit's head off by accident and get covered in blood i'm sure i'll have lots of fun explaining it to the neighbours

 

[British Red]

humblebumble

Bear in mind that Scotland tried to pass a bill to ban ownership of airguns except for council licensed pest controllers. They would not have been available even on a firearms certificate.

Now I don't want to get into politics either - but I guess I'm trying to show the humane and sensible use of a tool

Red

 

[humblebumble]

i wasn't aware of the Red, and i completely agree with you.

wait a second, would that mean you could own a shotgun, rifle or pistol, but not an airgun?

the thing is that a nutter can turn anything into a weapon. i don't see any moves to ban glass bottles (wait a minute, i take that back, sorry). whether to consfiscate weapons or not should be left to the judgement of the police in maintaining public order and preventing injury. whether guns, knives or point-ed sticks

 

[British Red]

wait a second, would that mean you could own a shotgun, rifle or pistol, but not an airgun?

Yep.

I know - odd huh?

Still...I didn't want to grandstand this or anything. Putting down sick or injured animals is normal. But there are times when an airgun is the tool for the job. I would normally prefer to use a rimmy, shotgun or centre fire, but, sometimes, something with lower power is enough and safer and more responsible.

I do understnad there have been problems with airguns - as there have with knives and many other tools.

I was just pointing out the positive sides I guess

Red

 

[humblebumble]

i really don't know the first thing about guns.

used to know some local boys who went air-gun hunting in the woods i was living in down south a few years ago. used to give us rabbits if they'd got more than they wanted.

yum

 

[BorderReiver]

i really don't know the first thing about guns.

used to know some local boys who went air-gun hunting in the woods i was living in down south a few years ago. used to give us rabbits if they'd got more than they wanted.

yum

If they did that now they would have an armed response unit after them.

I think we're safe as long as the debt crisis lasts. The meeja can't concentrate on two shock horror scandal stories at once.

 

[HillBill]

There is definately a place for the humble airgun. Be it, ferals in the barns and hay lofts or rats among the grain silos or animal sheds, places where a shotgun, rimfire or centrefire would be way too much.

They are the most discreet among all firearms and also have a major fun factor in there too. I mean you can't line cans or whatever up in your garden and plink away with a 12 bore or .243.

One of my favourite things about an air rifle over other firearms is the absoloute necessity of accuracy over power. They teach good shooting practices if one wants to be successful and stalking with an air rifle requires more skill than others as you are always within spitting distance of your quarry. You need to be good and know what you are doing.


Good on ya Red, You did the right thing ( as you know)

 

[Doc]

One of my favourite things about an air rifle over other firearms is the absoloute necessity of accuracy over power. They teach good shooting practices if one wants to be successful and stalking with an air rifle requires more skill than others as you are always within spitting distance of your quarry. You need to be good and know what you are doing.


Good on ya Red, You did the right thing ( as you know)

I'd agree with that. I shoot rabbits with a .22 rimfire, and most are taken at 40 to 60 yards. I admire the skill of the air rifle man who has to get closer, and be more precise in judging range and wind.

 

[deeps]

Why is it necessary to provide a HSE warning to the sqeamish in the thread title?

Let's not apologise else we'll end up like the BBC with a minder on site when we log on to BCUK

... and if you feel you have been effected by any of the issues discussed in this thread please feel free to call the helpline number on ......

Country gorn to the dogs

 

[fishfish]

shame you dont have any ferrets theydv loved it!

 

[British Red]

Never been ferreting - not that I wouldn't love to know more - just never had the chance

 

[firecrest]

But if its so kind how come we aren't allowed to do that with people?

*light touch paper....*

 

[BigShot]

Maybe because people ≠ animals.
Same reason we can't have pet humans, humans that work for no more than feed and housing (with no choice in the matter) or humans for food.
Simple enough really.



Red:
Can you give a brief overview of the law with regard to carrying an using an air pistol in public? Obviously their use on a permission would be clear as day but when it comes to being out in parks (got a couple of biggies around here) and the countryside at large what's the rules on carry and shooting? A few times I've seen sick birds that were quite clearly on their way out but couldn't get close enough to do anything and something like a pistol would have been really handy.

EDIT:
If you'd rather not discuss that side of things in here, feel free to PM a response and I'll take that part of the post out.
Good shooting and good on you - by the way.

 

[Matt.S]

I am not a lawyer, nor do I portray one on TV. That said...

Until just a few years ago adults were basically at liberty to stroll around with and use an air-gun wherever they liked -- even loaded -- so long as they didn't do anything stupid/dangerous/illegal.

This has changed, so assume the some rules as 'Section 1' firearms -- don't load it, don't flaunt it, don't carry it without permission and good reason. I'm sure if Mr Plod found you carrying a loaded air-pistol in public there would be a lot more questions asked than if you were carrying say a high quality PCP rifle with a pellet in the breech.

 

[wingbone]

Thats it in a nutshell.

I do feel this in lots of ways. On Wayland's "future of Bushcraft" thread I noticed lots of parralels of things being "banned" - from bowhunting (never done it) to fox hunting (never done it) to pistol shooting (done it).

It often surprises me how people are unwilling to defend other peoples rights but expect other people to defend ours.

I think its about time that we learned that we cannot prevent people doing wrong, and trying to remove the equipment to do wrong will not prevent wrong doing. Indeed it only punishes the law abiding and does more harm than good in removing the tool from its correct use.

I struggle to understand how we have come to this point as a society where we go around banning this and that in the expectation of improving life.

I suspect the ultimate conclusion is when we are all forced to live in sterile, air conditioned, hermetically sealed boxes and only interact via video screen.

If you believe in the bible...It tells me that when there were but four people in the world, Cain killed his brother with a club...it's got nuttin to do with the club or the gun. Its between the ears.

 

[tobes01]

Too true. Sadly for those in Scotland, it's all going to become somewhat tougher with new air rifle legislation on the top of the devolution agenda...

 

[Ogri the trog]

The whole "Ban this and licence that" arguement has a sound basis.
In the UK, we have far too high a population to allow all and sundry to go about pulling the trigger on any type of fire-arm, sooner or later someone will get hurt. As this is becoming a more regular occurance, the "populace" decide something should be done!
To my mind, the "powers that be" have no objection to those who have a legitimate reason to shoot and are intent on removing the tools from the hands of those who cannot demonstrate that legitimate reason. So having the necessary paperwork is not a wholy bad thing. The problem arrises when those powers try to imply poorly thought through limits to the legislation.
Around my area there are teenagers who show a more mature attitude to shooting than a number of 20/30 year olds, so I don't always agree with set age limits.
Another problem will certainly crop up when banning something that has, until now, been permissable without any form of licencing - you are reliant upon the honesty of former owner to relinquish thier arms.
Clearly, those whose intentions are less than honourable are the least likely to give them up.


Ogri the trog

 

[scott mcmillan]

good point. when they banned hang guns all they did was stop club shooters from shooting legaly . they didnt stop bad people from using guns to rob post offices

its the same with knifes now they have banned access to most forms of knifes. the only ones young people can get now are kitcken knifes so people now get stabed with something 12" long insted of something 2" long. knife crime is not new just the size of the blade

 

[British Red]

Hmm slightly different occurence today

Looked out the window at the turkeys...that we haven't got

Phoned the farm and the keeper came round and we rounded up the escapees. Wonder how they got through the (electric) fence he said. Electric to keep foxy out clearly. It hadn't kept foxy out (dug round the gate post of the post and rail inside the leccy) . The panicked birds had taken off and charged the fence.

We repenned them. Walking back for a cup of tea we found the one laid up under a hedge that foxy had caught. I won't post photos but suffice it to say a broom handle and a tug was called for. Foxy hadn't managed to kill but had had a good feed none the less.

The guy is sick of foxes. 70 have been taken with rifles this year so far. They keep on coming despite electric and buried fencing etc. Still, I rather feel the guns may get an outing tonight!

Red