Scandi Grind
- Thread starter Barney
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Are you looking for suggestions, or are you just saying that for the sake of it? 
What sorta knife? What sorta edge angles are we talking about? Sorry for being a bit pedantic, but poor edge retention is down to steel, heat treatment, geometry or a combination of all three; solutions will vary according to which. If a scandi has a 50 degree bevel and is too weak, Scandi ain't the problem
I agree with Michiel though, assuming that the steel and HT are good, a good thorough stropping will put a nice little secondary microbevel on the blade that improves performance immensely; all my Jonsson Moras have it (they have a 14 degree primary bevel IIRC, and with the microbevel can batton seasoned oak while keeping a very good edge) and my Enzo has it. If you find that isn't enough, stick a bit of 600 or 800 grit paper (or finer) on a bit of mousemat and sharpen with the edge trailing, then move on to stropping. It's never failed me
Pete
PS: If you strop, it's a good idea to steel the blade as well. Stropping can create a little burr on the edge of the blade that has a tendancy to fold - steeling will align it properly, minimising this problem.
What sorta knife? What sorta edge angles are we talking about? Sorry for being a bit pedantic, but poor edge retention is down to steel, heat treatment, geometry or a combination of all three; solutions will vary according to which. If a scandi has a 50 degree bevel and is too weak, Scandi ain't the problem
I agree with Michiel though, assuming that the steel and HT are good, a good thorough stropping will put a nice little secondary microbevel on the blade that improves performance immensely; all my Jonsson Moras have it (they have a 14 degree primary bevel IIRC, and with the microbevel can batton seasoned oak while keeping a very good edge) and my Enzo has it. If you find that isn't enough, stick a bit of 600 or 800 grit paper (or finer) on a bit of mousemat and sharpen with the edge trailing, then move on to stropping. It's never failed me
Pete
PS: If you strop, it's a good idea to steel the blade as well. Stropping can create a little burr on the edge of the blade that has a tendancy to fold - steeling will align it properly, minimising this problem.
Thanks for the replies.
Pete I dont know, just frustrated. You see so many on here saying that a flat scandi is the perfect Bushcraft grind That I am almost scared to open my gob and have an opinion.
Anyway I find the edge weak for all but carving thin shavings and slicing tomatoes. My edges that I am ruining are good hand made bushcraft knives one in O1 and another in D2 They are heat treated in temperature controlled ovens and not just "home done". I can batton to split logs down the grain without too much trouble but as soon as I try to knock off side branches or batton through the diameter of a log then I am wrecking them making a right mess of the edges. I am getting back to shaving sharp easy enough but am sick of the perpetual re forming of the edge.
Do you think that the secondry will work and what angle should it be?
Why does everyone say the flat scandi grind is perfect? am i expecting too much?
Pete I dont know, just frustrated. You see so many on here saying that a flat scandi is the perfect Bushcraft grind That I am almost scared to open my gob and have an opinion.
Anyway I find the edge weak for all but carving thin shavings and slicing tomatoes. My edges that I am ruining are good hand made bushcraft knives one in O1 and another in D2 They are heat treated in temperature controlled ovens and not just "home done". I can batton to split logs down the grain without too much trouble but as soon as I try to knock off side branches or batton through the diameter of a log then I am wrecking them making a right mess of the edges. I am getting back to shaving sharp easy enough but am sick of the perpetual re forming of the edge.
Do you think that the secondry will work and what angle should it be?
Why does everyone say the flat scandi grind is perfect? am i expecting too much?
Don't be daft mateThanks for the replies.
Pete I dont know, just frustrated. You see so many on here saying that a flat scandi is the perfect Bushcraft grind That I am almost scared to open my gob and have an opinion.
I've certainly not used a zero-ground scandi as a general purpose knife for a long time, and I'm sure that some others are the same; some using different grind altogether like full flats and convex. Mora of Sweden put microbevels on as standard, so I don't think anyone can argue that it's a bad idea I'm honestly not sure why zero-ground scandis are so popular. They do woodworking excellently, and that's why I keep my sloyd zero ground! But that is their niche, and IMO that's not worth the hassle given that I could just carry my sloyd as well! You take a lot of metal off with sharpening zero-ground, too.
I don't really know what angle to suggest, what I normally do is sharpen with the bevel flat on the sandpaper on the mouse mat. Applying light pressure will push into the mouse mat ever so slightly, giving a slight convexed secondary. I'd try that first, the smaller the angle you can get away with the better IMO! If that doesn't do, I'd lift the back of the knife up an additional 5 degrees or so and try that. If you do lift it up, do NOT apply much pressure to the edge of the knife - little more pressure than the weight of the knife, or you'll whip the edge right off it! Give it a go mate
I did find that I still had to sharpen the flats to stop the microbevel getting too far back before I got the hang of it.Pete
Right, I have had a bit of a strop on the leather with autosol as the abrasive medium.
I am going to batton down some Sycamore to make a spoon. MIght try a living wood firestick with it as well.
I am going to batton down some Sycamore to make a spoon
. MIght try a living wood firestick with it as well.Right, I have had a bit of a strop on the leather with autosol as the abrasive medium.
I am going to batton down some Sycamore to make a spoon
Keep us posted mate
Pete
Thanks for the replies.
Pete I dont know, just frustrated. You see so many on here saying that a flat scandi is the perfect Bushcraft grind That I am almost scared to open my gob and have an opinion.
Anyway I find the edge weak for all but carving thin shavings and slicing tomatoes. My edges that I am ruining are good hand made bushcraft knives one in O1 and another in D2 They are heat treated in temperature controlled ovens and not just "home done". I can batton to split logs down the grain without too much trouble but as soon as I try to knock off side branches or batton through the diameter of a log then I am wrecking them making a right mess of the edges. I am getting back to shaving sharp easy enough but am sick of the perpetual re forming of the edge.
Do you think that the secondry will work and what angle should it be?
Why does everyone say the flat scandi grind is perfect? am i expecting too much?
For battoning id use a thick scandi with mico bevel or a proper convex. Or an Axe.
For everything else a scandi grind will do a great job.
As with most tasks I reckon there is no one tool to do all jobs perfectly, but normally a scandi will do most them adequately with regular sharpening, providing they're of good quality and at least 3mm thick.
I recomend that you have one knife for carving and one allround knife with secondary bevel. But as shinken said its all up to angles.
Seved
Seved
Have a chat with Dave Budd (should be able to PM him) as he has some interesting views of edge grinds/finishing and the knowledge and experience to back them up. He may be be able to suggest further alternatives or confirmation of some of the ideas above.
No idea of the nagles on different knives, but I suppose the reason some of the custom knives, the Woodlore being a prime example, are so thick is to allow a more robust angle on the grind. The finer the englae, the greater the chance of the edge rolling over.
I stick a micro bevel on my scandi knives now after sharpening by stroking the bevel with a small jasper stone. The difference it makes is noticeable.
I stick a micro bevel on my scandi knives now after sharpening by stroking the bevel with a small jasper stone. The difference it makes is noticeable.
