Well, border controls have certainly gone down the pan.
Don't flush, the water in the cistern might be useful
Scoops
Well, border controls have certainly gone down the pan.
I dont think they are fearful of it Paul, I think half the loonies in this thread are wishing it upon us, so they can go out into the apocalypse and practice thier post-destruction-of-society survival skills.
This is not new-orleans, it's not the apocalypse, it's England with a bit of a flood. Good grief what people would need is clean water, dry clothes, blankets and disposable nappies for the kids, not firesteels, tarps and pot-hangers. The military wont be comming to herd us into compounds, if they come it'll be to fill sand-bags, hand out water and give out food.
What really scares me, isn't the "sheeple" of which I am proud to say I'm one, it's the sociopathic, walter-mitty, nutcases with a pathological hatred of society, that actually fantasise about it's downfall. I even read one comment that a person would go into a school to steal some food before heading to the hills - how resonsible is that? ...
Personally, as a loon, I'd be avoiding those who seem to delight in causing conflict...
Bushcraft and Survival skills[/b]?
Or is survival in this context restricted to getting lost in the woods?
Eric
Thanks everyone for making this an extremely interesting and, to me, very valuable thread. It was never intended to go beyond the realistic scenario I originally suggested, but the offshoots have given me a tremendous amount of information about relationships and human dynamics that I can use when I get back to writing my book. A couple of publishers have read the first 56,000 words and both have said it needs fleshing out. The characters need personalities and there aren't enough bad guys with personal agendas in it. With the above information I now feel I can give my characters personalities (Not that I had that in mind when I started the thread).
Oh, and to those who think there's no place for survivalism on a bushcraft site, perhaps you could tell me why this section of the forum is called Bushcraft and Survival skills?
Or is survival in this context restricted to getting lost in the woods?
Eric
...
Psychotic
Lets practice this!
Sociopathic
AND hand the children guns too! (Yes exactly, where did the guns come in?????)...
...Im s o r r y to have such an opinion and to have helped all you who stand on a different type of hill to think so strongly negatively of me and made myself the crazy one...
...But I feel that some here may lack the compassion and understand that I would have for them...
...My goal was to never have a crazy militia type setting. It was to avoid it...
...I felt that I thought of a way how to but went too far trying to show everyone that, over explaining it, over analyzing it, turning it into the think I hated to begin with...
...I have plenty of good reason to distrust people...
...But I have what it takes in me to try and understand that and help those people find their own strengths regardless. At least the majority in a random group would appreciate that after they got over their broken nails...
...Again Im s o r r y...
I've followed this thread since the first day, and responded once; back with the "normal" people on the first page. I agree with many of you that this thread has gone too far from the original topic. I'm jumping back into the frey to make an observation that I think some of you have caught but others missed.
Where you live in this situation is the major determining factor. When I lived in the city, I lived in the worst neighborhood possible, where sunrise was a sufficient enough disaster to drive people to mayhem. Drug dealers, muggers, prostitutes, bad cops and worse criminals... Now, 18 months later, I live at the end of a dirt road, surrounded by pot farmers who's skills include blacksmithy, milling, hunting (We even have a vegitarian who bow hunts deer with non-lethal annoyance arrows) we have kids, elders, and even a fair amount of people my age. (30s)
In the city, it is a pressure cooker, which is why alot of us, when living in the city, are so adamant about getting out to the woods. Though more people lived within 3 miles of me, than live within 30 miles of me now, there was almost no community. I had a group of about 35 people who all worked together, but in the event of a disaster, most of us would leave.
Living out here in the mountains, there is no way I would leave. The community is there, the friends are there, and a number of those 35 people left in the city have maps and guides to get here in an emergency.
The funny thing is, one of my new neighbors told me that the best time up here is the four or five days a year when the road gets blocked and everyone takes a snow day. The hill comes alive with everyone running around on horses, 4wd drive vehicles, and even skis as everyone gathers for warmth, food and comradeship and to make sure everyone is tended to and has enough groceries for the time being.
So far, the nihilistic, lord of the flies views seem to have come from those who are describing their cities. It makes sense if you lie in a city. Having lived in a few cities in my life, it makes sense. If the social order is intact and you have murder and rape everyday, I would certainly not want to hang around if the social order got mucked.
I would also like to point out that, as an American, hearing "This isn't New Orleans" is a bit offensive, especially if you happen to be an American who knew people down there and knew what terrible actions were taken by the government in the wake if the disaster. It was Katrina that taught alot of people that they would need to tend to themselves, and one of the reasons our local Community Emergency Response Team took on more than a search and rescue role, beginning training on any skills that might be needed in a disaster. Reading this thread from the begining, when I heard, go with the authorities, I thought of the police and national guard actions in New Orleans, holding people in areas with the threat of force, flying helicopters over people begging for rescue with loud speakers saying "looters will be shot", turning away aid being shipped in by everybody from Walmart to people who traveled from Burning Man to aid in setting up shelter cities. Seriously, If I woke up and there was a guy with a FEMA shirt banging at my front door, I'd probably run out the back door.
..."It's not their fault, they don't know what they are supposed to do...
...And as for the contamination of bowser water, why not have the armed forces guarding them and setting up proper water points? There is a bit of kit designed to remove nuclear, chemical and biological contaminants from water that is packed on the back of a trailer towed by a truck, and uses reverse osmosis. Stick a bit of tentage on the back of the wagon and some basic rations and a field cook kit to cater for the soldiers and set the distribution point up, ran by soldiers and protected by soldiers. If they are polluting their own water, then the only other way is to ration water by doing a house to house delivery...
Why?I would also like to point out that, as an American, hearing "This isn't New Orleans" is a bit offensive,
Well that's exactly what I meant by "this isn't New Orleans". Meaning it was exceptionally bad for a whole bunch of reasons that are unique to that situation, most of which you've covered above. The situation we have in England, is a million miles away from what you had in New Orleans.especially if you happen to be an American who knew people down there and knew what terrible actions were taken by the government in the wake if the disaster. It was Katrina that taught alot of people that they would need to tend to themselves, and one of the reasons our local Community Emergency Response Team took on more than a search and rescue role, beginning training on any skills that might be needed in a disaster. Reading this thread from the begining, when I heard, go with the authorities, I thought of the police and national guard actions in New Orleans, holding people in areas with the threat of force, flying helicopters over people begging for rescue with loud speakers saying "looters will be shot", turning away aid being shipped in by everybody from Walmart to people who traveled from Burning Man to aid in setting up shelter cities. Seriously, If I woke up and there was a guy with a FEMA shirt banging at my front door, I'd probably run out the back door.
Indeed I have Becky, in England, most of us have had protected, soft and cozy lives. There is very little here to justify any degree of paranoia. In the US, things are different, In the US some of the survivalist mentality is perhaps a little justified, but importing the mindset and applying it to the UK is banannas. People here are into it, because they like it, not because there is an overwhelming threat of anarchy, disaster or destruction. There is no justification, they just enjoy the fantasy.Bushcraft
“What is in your kit if something happens?
Survival
“What would you do if this happened?”
Psychotic
“Lets practice this!”
Sociopathic
“AND hand the children guns too!” (Yes exactly, where did the guns come in?????)
If you think this thread is crazy, then you can be very happy to know you have grown in a protected life. Please take that statement as a compliment.
Im s o r r y to have such an opinion and to have helped all you who stand on a different type of hill to think so strongly negatively of me and made myself the “crazy” one. But I feel that some here may lack the compassion and understand that I would have for them.
My goal was to never have a crazy militia type setting. It was to avoid it. I felt that I thought of a way how to but went too far trying to show everyone that, over explaining it, over analyzing it, turning it into the think I hated to begin with. I have plenty of good reason to distrust people when they do something that is well outside their typical rationalized thinking. But I have what it takes in me to try and understand that and help those people find their own strengths regardless. At least the majority in a random group would appreciate that after they got over their broken nails.
Again Im s o r r y.
Becky
. No less than 86% have voted to leg it into the hills and turn thier back on everyone else..
...People here [UK] are into it, because they like it, not because there is an overwhelming threat of anarchy, disaster or destruction. There is no justification, they just enjoy the fantasy...
You are right about being in a minority Scoops, unfortunately in the world we live in there are to many big companies with too much money to loose by cutting down on emmisions etc and to get away with it they build ther factories and industrial sites in what we know as third world countries where ther are no governing laws so the crisis will inevitably play out to the end, when everything goes t*ts up.
I don't want to launch off into politics but I feel the need to 'defend' my position, because frankly, I don't think I'm the one who's mad...
You are right about being in a minority Scoops, unfortunately in the world we live in there are to many big companies with too much money to loose by cutting down on emmisions etc and to get away with it they build ther factories and industrial sites in what we know as third world countries...
...So by preparing oneself, even if that means passing on this preparation to our siblings for the future then we can at least believe we and our chldren may be able to survive the coming DOOMSDAY!!!...
...and buys clothes from sweatshops because that is what we demand...