do you need a licence

[FGYT]

With a Pre charged set at 11.5flb with HN FTT will be over the top with a heaver pellet . The problem is the police do not test guns with a standard weight pellet. so your gun can be legal but fail when tested by the police depending what they are using on that particular day.

yes it can but they usually test first with the pellets you are found with and should take a diffent view if they are doing 11.5ftlbs and a super heavy pellet does 12.01ft lbs
than if they test your pellets and get 18ft lbs

yes both guns are technically FAC but the cops arnt quite as daft as we all think and think a good lawyer would be able to argue that you have taken REASONABLE steps to run a non FAC gun so doubtful the CPS would pursue it. tho the cops would still try and intimidate you into taking a caution and removing the gun for disposal

the 18ft lbs is go straight to jail do not pass go etc.

manufactures these days are so paranoid that guns come out at even as low as 10ft lbs on normal pellets and fitted with anti tamper screws

for FT i used to run my 177 Anshutz Comp gun at a couple of FPS under and we had to shoot chrono lane on the shoot i would set it with an allen key on the practice range chrono and when about to go home drop it to 10ft lbs again for travel

i also drive at 69 on the motor way not 50

ATB

Duncan

 

[Opal]

I know a guy who can get me an AK47, no questions asked, of course, I live in the Middle East...

Bit overkill for bunnies though.

Same here but they do ask questions..."how many do you want?"

 

[Neumo]

It is possable for a 12ft pound air rifle to run at 1000 ft second IF it uses a very light pellet in .177, but for most people the answer is NO, as has been said above. That is because foot pounds is the measurement & foot pounds is decided in part by the weight of the pellet. It needs to be doing 11.5ft pounds max, with standard 8.5 grain pellets to be safe. The testing for this varies wildly with each police force, from what I have heard, although things are getting better. Temeperature also play a big part, as I have seen factory guns go over the limit on a hot day, when the extra heat in the resevoir increases the temeprature.

I would get it chronoed privately, as some shops can get funny if they find a rifle they test to be over & have heard of people not getting their guns back, cops being called etc..

 

[FGYT]

I would get it chronoed privately, as some shops can get funny if they find a rifle they test to be over & have heard of people not getting their guns back, cops being called etc..

they wont let it go until its back under 12ft lbs or they could get prosecuted they will offer you to alter it for a fee obviously but dont expect them to put their lively hood at risk by breaking the law they arnt being funny any more than me refusing to sell a knife to an under 18 (cause Im not going to jail for it )
I expect the Cops may have been called out in extreme cases where its way over and the person is kicking up about having it back NOW

 

[Ogri the trog]

The key part of the legal wording of the UK law, is that an air rifle should not "be capable" of exceeding 12ftlbs muzzle energy.
All this talk of 11.5, 11.6 etc. levels are different peoples interpretation of how to limit that capability. If you have a rifle that can be oiled, heated, field-tweaked or use "pure un-obtainium" pellets so that it produces over 12 ftlb you are open to prosecution - if you want a rifle that can exceed 12 ftlb, move abroad or apply for a firearms certificate.

I will concede that the 12 foot/pound limit was brought in at a time when British industry could barely attain that figure, yet it was based upon earlier research that noted a rabbit only needed 4 foot pounds of energy to penetrate its skull and therefore represent a clean kill. It was also a time when small-bore firearms and shotguns were the accepted norm for taking prey for the pot and gun crime was significantly less common than it is today.

Ogri the trog

 

[ged]

Just to get back to the original question, other than pose value amongst ill-educated friends why would anyone even want to use an air rifle which has such a high muzzle velocity?

It's very hard to make something fly stably through the air both at speeds well below the speed of sound and at speeds which approach the speed of sound. Ask any Vulcan pilot. The flight of an air rifle pellet is much more stable at lower speeds (400fps-700fps) than it is as they approach the speed of sound (about 1100fps). That means, other things being equal, if the pellets are going almost as fast as sound then the rifle will be much less accurate than it could be. At such high velocities, over any plausible range for an air rifle the pellets will start to tumble in flight, and then they'll be all over the place.

This is not true for bullets, which gain much stability from their spin. Spin contributes very little to the stability of an air rifle pellet. As far as a pellet is concerned it's all about aerodynamics, and the aerodynamic qualities of the average air rifle pellet actually suck. That's because, unfortunately, air is used to propel them in the first place, and if they had good aerodynamics they couldn't be launched that way.

Unless there's some compelling reason, I don't think the OP really wants that rifle.

 

[nodd]

Its human nature to get to .999999999 of any limit set why? different pellets perform better at different velocities and its not always right on the limit

 

[nodd]

Most Accurate FAC I have shot was a Sportsmatch GC2 firing.177 HN silhouette at over 900 fps I was asked by the owner to zero the gun for him zeroed at 40 yards only had about an inch drop at 65 yards.

 

[shaggystu]

......Spin contributes very little to the stability of an air rifle pellet.......

why not?

stuart

 

[Corso]

The key part of the legal wording of the UK law, is that an air rifle should not "be capable" of exceeding 12ftlbs muzzle energy.
All this talk of 11.5, 11.6 etc. levels are different peoples interpretation of how to limit that capability. If you have a rifle that can be oiled, heated, field-tweaked or use "pure un-obtainium" pellets so that it produces over 12 ftlb you are open to prosecution - if you want a rifle that can exceed 12 ftlb, move abroad or apply for a firearms certificate.

I will concede that the 12 foot/pound limit was brought in at a time when British industry could barely attain that figure, yet it was based upon earlier research that noted a rabbit only needed 4 foot pounds of energy to penetrate its skull and therefore represent a clean kill. It was also a time when small-bore firearms and shotguns were the accepted norm for taking prey for the pot and gun crime was significantly less common than it is today.

Ogri the trog

Realy? Would have expected a little more pragmatism to be honest - Airsoft guns for instance 'could' be turned into section 5 firearms (by definition) with not much more than a new spring - does it therefore mean all airsoft guns are illegal because they could be?

 

[ged]

why not?

A pellet is more like a shuttlecock than a bullet. The head of the pellet is densest, and the skirt is relatively light. No matter whether it's pointed, domed or hollow point, most of the force slowing it down is on its face, and the air in its wake is turbulent, so the skirt is continually trying to overtake the head and it wobbles slightly in flight. As it's spinning, this wobble also causes precession which doesn't necessarily help matters. The skirt (hopefully) at least prevents it from tumbling.

So the pellet needs to be symmetrical. That's what's important for stability. It's hollow, so it's harder to make it as symmetrical as makes no difference than if it were a solid cylindrical lump of metal. Because it has to be cheap, it's harder still. A poorly made or damaged pellet which has its centre of gravity offset from the centre of the rifle barrel can be seriously destabilized as it leaves the barrel because it is spinning.

 

[shaggystu]

A pellet is more like a shuttlecock than a bullet. The head of the pellet is densest, and the skirt is relatively light. No matter whether it's pointed, domed or hollow point, most of the force slowing it down is on its face, and the air in its wake is turbulent, so the skirt is continually trying to overtake the head and it wobbles slightly in flight. As it's spinning, this wobble also causes precession which doesn't necessarily help matters. The skirt (hopefully) at least prevents it from tumbling.

So the pellet needs to be symmetrical. That's what's important for stability. It's hollow, so it's harder to make it as symmetrical as makes no difference than if it were a solid cylindrical lump of metal. Because it has to be cheap, it's harder still. A poorly made or damaged pellet which has its centre of gravity offset from the centre of the rifle barrel can be seriously destabilized as it leaves the barrel because it is spinning.

thanks for that

stuart

 

[FGYT]

A pellet is more like a shuttlecock than a bullet. The head of the pellet is densest, and the skirt is relatively light. No matter whether it's pointed, domed or hollow point, most of the force slowing it down is on its face, and the air in its wake is turbulent, so the skirt is continually trying to overtake the head and it wobbles slightly in flight. As it's spinning, this wobble also causes precession which doesn't necessarily help matters. The skirt (hopefully) at least prevents it from tumbling.

So the pellet needs to be symmetrical. That's what's important for stability. It's hollow, so it's harder to make it as symmetrical as makes no difference than if it were a solid cylindrical lump of metal. Because it has to be cheap, it's harder still. A poorly made or damaged pellet which has its centre of gravity offset from the centre of the rifle barrel can be seriously destabilized as it leaves the barrel because it is spinning.

which is why pointed pellets have normally been very bad in accuracy they never have the point in the middle etc domed are easier and generally more accurate

also a small squeeze on a pellet skirt will loose you 30-40 fps at the muzzle again why a pocket of pellets is usually less accurate they have been bashed about