Mining The Wilderness

[DavidJT]

Worrying article about the massive mining boom in the far North.

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2014/sep/03/mining-threat-northern-europe-wilderness-finland-sweden-norway

Heard a Sami singer give an unexpected, and very political speech about this to an audience which included some rather disgruntled looking Swedish politicians. She likened current events to the plot of Avatar.

(Mods hope this is more environmental than political)

 

[boatman]

Stop using the products containing these mined minerals or stop complaining when they are mined.

 

[British Red]

Like electricity?

 

[Swallow]

Stop using the products containing these mined minerals or stop complaining when they are mined.

Like electricity?

Already did.

http://www.goodenergy.co.uk/switch/where-our-energy-comes-from

 

[slowworm]

Already did.

http://www.goodenergy.co.uk/switch/where-our-energy-comes-from

Rare earth mining, to produce parts of wind turbines and solar panels, is some of the most damaging mining there is. That's ignoring the fact most of your actual electricity still comes from gas, coal and nuclear.

 

[Swallow]

Rare earth mining, to produce parts of wind turbines and solar panels, is some of the most damaging mining there is. That's ignoring the fact most of your actual electricity still comes from gas, coal and nuclear.

Read the chart on the link.

 

[slowworm]

Read the chart on the link.

I'm fully aware of their claims, are you? It's offsetting, so the electricity you use is likely to come from the usual sources. Some will be solar, wind etc but most isn't. Look at how the national grid works as well as looking up problems around rare earth mining.

 

[Swallow]

I'm fully aware of their claims, are you? It's offsetting, so the electricity you use is likely to come from the usual sources. Some will be solar, wind etc but most isn't. Look at how the national grid works as well as looking up problems around rare earth mining.

I will most certainly be looking into the rare earth thing.

I'm not sure how you get the idea it is off-setting.

They are building windfarms, solar etc and selling it to the grid.

Obviously I don't get the electrons they themselves produce....

but effectively I have taken my money out of funding the status quo.....and into funding the growth of (what appears to me) to be a better way.

And that feels way better than playing victim about it and pretending there is nothing I can do.

If there's betterer way thes please let me know.

And if you have info that they are not actually doing what they say, then please do PM it to me so I can kick their RRRs.

 

[slowworm]

From their own info "When you switch to us, we match all the electricity you use over a year with electricity sourced purely from renewables." I.e. if you use electricity on a still night it will be from fossil fuels or nuclear, then when it's windy or sunny they sell energy back to the grid. I.e. your energy has been offset. This would not be possible without the national grid and non-green energy production, so you are dependant on it to some extent.

There are also impacts in green energy production so the argument of reducing usage still applies.

 

[Swallow]

From their own info "When you switch to us, we match all the electricity you use over a year with electricity sourced purely from renewables." I.e. if you use electricity on a still night it will be from fossil fuels or nuclear, then when it's windy or sunny they sell energy back to the grid. I.e. your energy has been offset. This would not be possible without the national grid and non-green energy production, so you are dependant on it to some extent.

There are also impacts in green energy production so the argument of reducing usage still applies.

I think I ageed with that already (or tried to) when I said "Obviously I don't get the electrons they themselves produce...."

I didn't make any claim about not being dependant on the grid, I more tried to say I was changing the grid by using that supplier instead of another one.

It IS indeed only a first step.

 

[British Red]

Already did.

http://www.goodenergy.co.uk/switch/where-our-energy-comes-from

Wow - you found an electricity source that doesn't need iron?

What do you think they build wind turbines gantries out of?

...the things they are mining for are not just uranium, but the copper that goes into wires and the iron to make steel, which wind turbines sit on.

It really isn't simple.

If anyone wants to simply throw the main switch on their distribution board for six days a week, now that will make a difference.

 

[tiger stacker]

If anyone wants to simply throw the main switch on their distribution board for six days a week, now that will make a difference

Depends how you live, not everyone works away from home. People who are house bound by personal circumstances need all the help they require. Asset stripping remote regions, will only cease when alternative resources are utilised. Local housing authorities, are investing into renewable enrgy grants, providing employment. Restoring used sites is expensive but must be part of the initial contract.

 

[British Red]

My point exactly tiger stacker.

Unless people know where the copper came from in the wires that connect their house to the national grid, they do not know that they are not part of the problem.

I'm not sure what the alternative source of copper is to mining it though?

 

[tiger stacker]

Research is ongoing
http://www.computing.co.uk/ctg/news...ity-carbon-wiring-as-an-alternative-to-copper

I confess to not being au fait, conservation Vs responsible sourcing raw materal is interesting to read up.

 

[British Red]

Carbon wiring is an interesting theory. But right now, in a world where the population is expanding, we still use copper. Its important to not that a major effect of stopping mining copper (in places such as Scandinavia) is to prevent the improvement in lifestyles of the under privileged in developing nations.

Its quite easy for us in our warm, well lit homes to type (via copper enabled wifi) how important it is not to mine in Scandinavia. Harder to believe for someone sat in the dark I suspect.

 

[santaman2000]

Wow - you found an electricity source that doesn't need iron?

What do you think they build wind turbines gantries out of?

...the things they are mining for are not just uranium, but the copper that goes into wires and the iron to make steel, which wind turbines sit on.

It really isn't simple.

If anyone wants to simply throw the main switch on their distribution board for six days a week, now that will make a difference.....

And the silver in solar panels.

 

[cottonwoodroot]

This is a very interesting debate. I would very much like to hear the opinion of anyone who has watched the film "Pandora's Promise". It is available on netflix. You might even be able to watch in on you tube. Any thoughts on was this film has to say?

 

[TeeDee]

This is a very interesting debate. I would very much like to hear the opinion of anyone who has watched the film "Pandora's Promise". It is available on netflix. You might even be able to watch in on you tube. Any thoughts on was this film has to say?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandora's_Promise


http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1992193/

 

[cottonwoodroot]

That's the film all right!! Did you get a chance to take a gander Tee Dee? What did you think?

 

[Dave]

The bottom line is from the time when jesus was born, to the time when the mayflower touched the shores of america, 1600 years or so, is how long it took the population of the world to double.

Im 41 years old, and it doubled again, from 3 billion to 6 billion plus, just in my lifetime.....

What we dont see and really feel is the effect thats had on all the other species, who evolved over the same period, of millions of years that we did.

Gotta say, I'd be happy for mother nature to wipe most of us humans out.....