Time to say Goodbye_from Abbe!

[anthonyyy]

I think if the posts about the skins had been deleted and Abbe’s post had been left, it would caused confusion.

Abbe’s post made no sense unless you read the previous posts he was replying to.



Perhaps we could all sing the following song by Billy “Can” Rankin
»


Abbe Come Back

I’m starin’at the four walls
Sittin’here, waitin’by the telephone
Your words are runnin’through my mind child
Cut me like a knife, you don’t wanna see me any more
Well I know you’re nothin’special
So how come you can be so impressional
I tried to figure it out, got a black out
I guess I call you inessential
Abbe come back, Abbe come back ‘cuz I’m all alone
Abbe come back, Abbe come back I’m in the danger zone
My heart ain’t made of plastic
I’m tellin’ya, I’m gonna do somethin’drastic, (drastic)
I’m trying to bide my time
Takin’my time_________________________
Well I know I’m not original
But listen here, I should be more than your provisional
You keep runnin’around, all around town
Actin’like a cool individual
Abbe come back, Abbe come back ‘cuz I’m all alone
Abbe come back, Abbe come back I’m in the danger zone
I said, Abbe come back, Abbe come back ‘cuz I’m all alone
Abbe come back, Abbe come back I’m in the danger zone
Abbe come back, back, back, back
Abbe come back, back, back, back
Abbe come back, back, back, back
Abbe come back, back, back, back
Abbe come back, back, back, back
Abbe come back, back, back, back
Abbe come back, back, back, back
Abbe come back I’m in the danger zone
I said, Abbe come back, Abbe come back ‘cuz I’m all alone
Abbe come back, (Ooh Abbe come back)Abbe come back I’m in the danger zone
I said, Abbe come back, Abbe come back
Abbe come back ‘cuz I’m all alone
Abbe come back, (Ooh Abbe come back)Abbe come back I’m in the danger zone
I said Abbe come back, Abbe come back, Abbe come back ‘cuz I’m all alone
Abbe come back, oh Abbe, Abbe come back I’m in the danger zone

 

[stovie]

A shame!

A real shame!

 

[bloodline]

This is a great loss to this forum can we afford to lose a member of this calibre who offers such great contribution with all of his posts and replies ? I have always looked forward to his latest thread or his well balanced replies.

 

[Martyn]

I'm not one to moan but I must agree with Bam.

Something must be wrong to hack off a balanced,sensible character like Abbe.
He has always been balanced and courteous in his posts and in his discussions on sensitive issues.

I have been modded once or twice,with good reason,and have had a PM to explain why.Has this practice been abandoned?

I can see that when dealing with numpties who obviously have an agenda,it would be a waste of time and effort.However,with a member of good standing,who has earned the respect of the majority of us,it would be good form to take the time to explain why the posts were being pulled/edited.

Hopefully the team can find it's old form and get this great forum back on the rails.

You're right BR and it's not lost on us.

I dont thing you'll find public apologies begging Abbe to return, because the general feeling is that when someone announces that they intend to leave, we are never sure whether or not someone is just making a point, or what. If people want to leave, then perhaps they should just leave.

however, in this case, Abbe has always seemed to be very balanced in everything he says and does and him leaving in such a way is very concerning indeed. It isnt going to change the "stock response", but privately, we are trying to address some issues.

I still dont agree that making a dramatic exit is the right way to move things forward and my gut reaction will always be "dont let the door smack you in the ***", but I've always liked Abbe as I know all the mods have, mainly because he's always seemed so BS free and well tuned. I'm surprised at him taking what I generally think to be a pretty silly option and can only assume it must be something pretty deep.

The impact of it is not lost on us.

 

[Stuart]

Aha.

I obviously don't want to tell the mods their business, but I think perhaps an apology might be in order here?

Ah my post has been removed by Admin, I'm not sure how to answer this without restating what has been removed.

I wasn’t aware that the 'reason for moderation' notes where not visible to the members, I don’t know if any of moderators were aware that the members couldnt see them! so all along we (I at least) have been leaving notes stating why things have been changed under the assumption that members could see the notes!

without reposting the content of my original (and subsequently removed) post all I can say is that the reason for the removal of Abbes post in the baker tent thread is made clear in Tony’s post which precedes it.

I think we should apoligise for our error in thinking that the members could see the notes left by the moderators, that certainly explains a great deal.

 

[Tony]

I wasn’t aware that the 'reason for moderation' notes where not visible to the members, I don’t know if any of moderators were aware that the members couldnt see them! so all along we (I at least) have been leaving notes stating why things have been changed under the assumption that members could see the notes!

I think we should apoligise for our error in thinking that the members could see the notes left by the moderators, that certainly explains a great deal.

Ahh, good point, I've tried to avoid posting in this thread as I don't want to clutter it. But Stuart's made a good point about thinking everyone could see the reasons for moderation, I have to admit that I also thought these were visible to all and not just the moderators!

My apologies for this situation, I've always been under the assumption that everyone could see why things had been done because we left an explanation, this has obviously led to some of the issues that are around at the moment and I take responsibility for this, all of us have been thinking one thing when something else has been happening. Sorry for the agro it's caused.

We've been talking behind the sense for a while now about moderation etc and I think the above leads me on to saying that we're going to ease off a bit on moderating, I still expect the standards of the site to be upheld but we're not going to remove so many posts and we're going to let more discussion etc take place, even if it's a tad heated, this does put the onus on you the members to keep things under control but I'm willing to give it a go. You all know where the lines are and know when you're stepping over, if you avoid doing that the pressure should ease for all of us. Lately there’s a few threads that have been allowed to continue when traditionally we’d have stopped them, these have ended up containing some good information and so I think there’s mileage in allowing this to become the norm. Remember though there’s a difference between debating and getting stuck in on a personal level.

Let’s get on with being part of a great community…

 

[weekend_warrior]

I'm travelling on biz right now, just logged on in my hotel to read this very sad news - a poor day for BCUK - I'm gutted.

Abbe, I've always enjoyed your posts and photos, they are the source of many a daydream for me. I wish you all you wish for yourself and I raise a glass to you fella.

Rich.

 

[JonnyP]

I wasn’t aware that the 'reason for moderation' notes where not visible to the members.

Stuart, this explains a lot to me and I hope you guys can see why there has been grumblings on here because of posts disappearing, you were writing an explanation, but we could not see it..........

 

[kaoss]

Bye abbe, good luck mate

 

[JonnyP]

We've been talking behind the sense for a while now about moderation etc and I think the above leads me on to saying that we're going to ease off a bit on moderating, I still expect the standards of the site to be upheld but we're not going to remove so many posts and we're going to let more discussion etc take place, even if it's a tad heated, this does put the onus on you the members to keep things under control but I'm willing to give it a go. You all know where the lines are and know when you're stepping over, if you avoid doing that the pressure should ease for all of us. Lately there’s a few threads that have been allowed to continue when traditionally we’d have stopped them, these have ended up containing some good information and so I think there’s mileage in allowing this to become the norm. Remember though there’s a difference between debating and getting stuck in on a personal level.

Let’s get on with being part of a great community…

This is good news Tony, of course we need modding on here, but letting a conversation flow, even if a bit heated is the way to go (me thinks), so long we keep to the rules, which I am sure we will. Threads do tend to digress and get pulled about, as does any conversation, so its good to hear that a thread like that will now be allowed to run.........

 

[Stuart]

Stuart, this explains a lot to me and I hope you guys can see why there has been grumblings on here because of posts disappearing, you were writing an explanation, but we could not see it..........

it is indeed all so clear now, funny how a tiny little thing like that can lead to such huge problems.

we write explanations, we can see them as notices stating who removed a post and why in the place of where the post used to be.

because we can see them we had no reason to think you couldnt and you didnt know there where there so you could tell us that you could see them........ crazy situation, but at least we now know what the root of all this trouble is.

 

[Toddy]

Duh! All that bother and aggro & confusion that we couldn't understand because we *had* left reasons when we modded something
Oh well, it's done and dusted. Hopefully it'll all sort itself out now.

Cheers,
Toddy

 

[bambodoggy]

It certainly explains a lot. Stuart/Tony thank you for your explanations and apologies, speaking for myself I know I'm far less bothered by goings on when I am given a reason for them.

I like the sound of the new Modding approach and hope it will help the site to flow more. As you say if it goes wrong then we now only have ourselves to blame

Cheers,

Bam.

 

[Martyn]

It certainly explains a lot. Stuart/Tony thank you for your explanations and apologies, speaking for myself I know I'm far less bothered by goings on when I am given a reason for them.

I like the sound of the new Modding approach and hope it will help the site to flow more. As you say if it goes wrong then we now only have ourselves to blame

Cheers,

Bam.

It'll still be moderated Bam, but the key phrase will be "treat each other with respect". Tony is advising us to allow some freedom and lattitude of expression, thread drift etc. Heated debate is fine - it's natural and it's partly because of some good outcomes from sensitive threads (such as the knife law thread) that we have shifted our thinking on this a little. But the onus is on you guys to keep it civil. There are a lot of different point of view on here and they are all valid.


We'll try not to make so many posts dissapear, instead, more posts will be left in place and perhaps edited, so people will get moderated publically if and when the need arises.

It's not so much about about less moderation, as clearly transparent moderation.

 

[Phil562]

It's not so much about about less moderation, as clearly transparent moderation.

Thats what we all want mate

 

[Martyn]

Thats what we all want mate

Yep, it seems to be the main bugbear over a number of discussions of late. Tony's given us guidelines to work to that will hopefully address this. The downside is that if you're on the recieving end of moderation, it's in public view and that might not sit well with some people. It's a slight change of tack for all of us and we'll just have to see how it pans out. I do feel it's a better way of doing things, and certainly people seem to want it.

 

[Scally]

i really dont want to change the subject of this topic but maybe a sticky on the site in another thread so other bushcrafters can be enlightened as much as everyone about the explainaitons because i am sure it will go a long way in sorting out past problems that we mortals can not see explanations left by mods on thread locking or changing ????????

 

[Greywolf]

Abbe, I have never met you but have read the majority of your posts and I feel that in some way we have become friends.

Wherever your journey takes you, walk safely, and keep warm when the north wind blows.

There will always be a place by the fire for you.


Greywolf

 

[rich59]

Abbe old son. I would be grateful if you would reconsider. Always enjoy your posts

 

[Abbe Osram]

Hi guys,

I am not leaving!

Very interesting things came up in the Thread which never where my intention to bring about. I didn’t rock the boat to press forward a change and certainly I didn’t want to draw any attention to my person.

Like Marty I believe that one should not try to press the forum to his personal will by threatening to leave. That was never my intention. I rather wanted to say Goodbye and give my friends and the people here knowledge where and why I was leaving BCUK.

Why then I am not leaving now?

Tony and the moderator team found out that there was a technical problem going on in the software, they actually where giving reasons and writing statements into the threads we never where able to see. I am sure if I had seen such a note from the moderator I would not have reacted so strongly.

Reading all your post, pm and e-mails I must say I am overwhelmed by the positive and creative spirit. Everyone writing was full of hopes that we can bring about something new and fresh. Hopefully even some of the old buddies many of us are missing are coming back.

I don’t want to be a big fat Diva, leaving with a bang, but want to see the changes here taking place and even doing my best to make it happen. I don’t want to be a sucker but a giver, so let us together not beat the people who give something good here on the head with stupid moral or political viewpoints. There is nothing wrong to discuss the meaning of trapping and hunting, I am all for a good strong and challenging discussion.

Why did I loose it?

Well, after working for 10 hours in the woods, I was tired and felt I need a little boost.
I went and found Erics new Baker Tent. His pictures inspired me again; I loved the feel in the pictures with the furs. I respect and like Erics generous spirit. He even made a pdf for us so we have it easier. Then I saw the post slashing Eric for the furs. Eric again being the nice guy explained himself. ( I got angry about the fact that he even had to explain) but he did.
Got slashed again. Now I wrote my post not being myself, not the balanced guy you know, as I was tired with it all. Instead of working to the positive I only wanted to get rid of all the problems. I wanted to concentrate on my life, not explaining anything anymore, not being upset about this hunting and trapping haters.

What now?
I am taking a break; I have to fix my cabin in some weeks before the snow falls. I will be anyhow dead tired most of the time and think it is a good time to get my creative and balanced spirit back, so I can give you something fresh and positive.

Tony wrote a very nice and supporting letter explaining what he and the moderator team are planning for the future, I am not going to disapoint him by leaving to early.

Therefore I choose to stay and do my best for a better future here at BCUK.

Yours
Abbe