many thanks Swampy i thought it may be that way, thing that gets me is the medic courses you do in the forces is far more in dept than the like of st johns, not that iam knocking st johns in anyway, thats the drama with the army not much is any use on civ steet
Recognised Bushcraft/Survival Skills qualifications?
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Welcome to the forum plainsurvivor 
You might find your qualifications don't have civi equivalents, but they would still look, and be, relevant on cv's. Not all outdoors training is focused on civilians. Lots of cadets, university groups and the like prefer a military structure to their teaching and training.
Like so many things, it's who you know who knows you, that gets you work.
cheers,
Toddy
You might find your qualifications don't have civi equivalents, but they would still look, and be, relevant on cv's. Not all outdoors training is focused on civilians. Lots of cadets, university groups and the like prefer a military structure to their teaching and training.
Like so many things, it's who you know who knows you, that gets you work.
cheers,
Toddy
IMHO
In your specific position, you could do a lot worse than to join IOL (Institute for Outdoor Learning), join their Bushcraft/Survival special interest group and sign up to one of John Ryders (level 3 or above) courses.
Like me, I don't think you will regret it. Even taking into account everything that has been said above.
Mark
In your specific position, you could do a lot worse than to join IOL (Institute for Outdoor Learning), join their Bushcraft/Survival special interest group and sign up to one of John Ryders (level 3 or above) courses.
Like me, I don't think you will regret it. Even taking into account everything that has been said above.
Mark
Just 'cottoned' on to this thread! (sorry). It's made me grin as I am new to this forum and amazed that this old chestnut is still doing the rounds. I have stood my ground on this for as many years as I can remember (not that it's done me much good). In normal civilian life, engineering, administration, building, teaching etc. qualifications are fine and they indicate that the person has knowledge commensurate with the level attained. This system works reasonably well on the whole. However, in survival, bushcraft, mountaincraft, combat survival, navigation etc. qualifications prove very little other than the possession of a few basic skills. This is because, predominantly, these topics require extremely strong mental strength; this cannot be taught and equally cannot be learned. Yes, with a qualification the person can demonstrate the required skills in a controlled environment; they may be totally useless under pressure! Just because someone has a qualification doesn't make them good or even proficient. It has always amazed me that the military mountain leader course was never recognised equally with the civilian course and frowned upon by many. A bushcraft/survival qualification gets you in the door, it doesn't and will never be an indication of someone who can actually do it when it really matters and lives are at stake. I have been frowned upon by including an 18 hour navigational exercise with only water to drink and no food at all at the end of the basic one week navigation course. I often find that the 'stars' of the course when everything is warm and comfortable are rarely the ones that navigate well on the test. It's a real eye-opener to see how going without food for a short while can affect certain people.
Unfortunately, we now live in a country where employers are only interested in a piece of paper to show to the insurance company when it all goes wrong... It keeps things nice and neat. Whereas if they actually employed people who can actually do it under would be far less accidents. I wonder just how many 'qualified' survival instructors would actually be able to light a fire with a knife and sparker in freezing rain and wind if they knew that if they failed they would be dead in 1 hour?
After saying all that, my views have lost me much work over the years because of my refusal to comply. Is it this unfailing tenacity that makes a good instructor?
Unfortunately, we now live in a country where employers are only interested in a piece of paper to show to the insurance company when it all goes wrong... It keeps things nice and neat. Whereas if they actually employed people who can actually do it under would be far less accidents. I wonder just how many 'qualified' survival instructors would actually be able to light a fire with a knife and sparker in freezing rain and wind if they knew that if they failed they would be dead in 1 hour?
After saying all that, my views have lost me much work over the years because of my refusal to comply. Is it this unfailing tenacity that makes a good instructor?
Scots_Charles_River
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
NForest Schools OCN Level 3, independently run bushcraft/forest school experiences.
That's the widest and most accepted one currently with the IOL Ones tagging on.
As with all Outdoor quals, it all adds up to lots of time and pennies !
As I have other outdoor quals, and teach Design & Technology - tools, sharps, forging - I am allowed to do Bushcraft skills without specialist qualifications in Bushcraft. Our council relies on previous personal and leadership experience.
That's the widest and most accepted one currently with the IOL Ones tagging on.
As with all Outdoor quals, it all adds up to lots of time and pennies !
As I have other outdoor quals, and teach Design & Technology - tools, sharps, forging - I am allowed to do Bushcraft skills without specialist qualifications in Bushcraft. Our council relies on previous personal and leadership experience.
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In my opinion it would be a shamful travesty if bushcraft prospects boiled down to a peice of paper. I somehow feel threatened by the mere existence of that qualification. I really don't know why but it scares me.
On second thoughts: If the pass is gained by a month in the wild with just a knife, an axe and a blanket then I'd say it's a good 'un. Show your potential employer a journal full of you bugging out on paper and look at them with the calm, wild eyes of a man-fox.
On second thoughts: If the pass is gained by a month in the wild with just a knife, an axe and a blanket then I'd say it's a good 'un. Show your potential employer a journal full of you bugging out on paper and look at them with the calm, wild eyes of a man-fox.
Just a quick note about the Forest School quals, in that they do not qualify you for Bushcraft/Survival skills at all. Forest School uses aspects of Bushcraft towards specific outcomes over long term programmes. Equally it uses Play towards these ends but it does not equate to a qualification in Play.
I may be wide of the mark here,. Had you considered building your own portfolio of skills, experience and having them verified by a recognised authority or independent witness. eg D of E examiner.
BC USA have a basic Sylabus/framework, could you use that ?
I understand the problem, it,s a chicken egg situation. You have to start somewhere or its only your 'word' of skills/experience. (Managerial phrase 'If it's not written, it hasn't happened).
Hope this helps
Crowe
BC USA have a basic Sylabus/framework, could you use that ?
I understand the problem, it,s a chicken egg situation. You have to start somewhere or its only your 'word' of skills/experience. (Managerial phrase 'If it's not written, it hasn't happened).
Hope this helps
Crowe
