Ray or Lofty - who's the daddy?

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G

Ginja

Guest
Greetings All. A very tongue-in-cheek post this ... as obviously everyone has a preference, and ultimately, who cares? But anyway, just been having a 'discussion' with a friend of mine over who's the better bushcraft/survival guru - Ray Mears or John "Lofty" Wiseman? Must admit I haven't met either in person, though based on books alone, I'm torn between Ray's enthusiasm and empathy with nature, and Lofty's no-nonsense approach to 'getting it sorted.'

If you have an opinion, go for it - my personal leaning is towards Lofty, so bring it on - who's the daddy?!

G ;-)
 

TheViking

Native
Jun 3, 2004
1,864
4
35
.
Hi...

I respect them both. Ray is surely great (though I never met him) and haven't really read anything on Lofty. I will agree with tenbears10! :wink: As you all may know, Ray is not military educated, but Lofty is. (very well indeed, you know why :wink:)

SAS doesn't learn to build log cabins and whittle a ball in a cage. They learn only what's necessary to survive out there and if they want to learn bushcraft, they must do this in their sparetime.
I don't think Ray has learnt it in the tough way, but can survive just as much in any climate, as Lofty. Off course you can always learn more, but I believe they have learned everything basic (and advanced) needed. :wink: :biggthump
 

ScottC

Banned
May 2, 2004
1,176
13
uk
Hello Ginja,

Lofty isn't a bushcraft guru IMO, Bushcraft is having a deeper understanding of nature and the wild and living in it comfortably which is what Ray is all about. Lofty is a survival teacher not a bushcraft teacher, his books and his teachings are how to deal with a situation where your life and the lives of others may be at risk and you may need to employ survival skills to stay alive.

However both are very closely intertwined, it is a tough question as Lofty served with the SAS for many years teaching survival for the most part of it. However Ray has travelled all over the world discovering first hand what our ancestors did to survive and has studied bushcraft and survival from a very early age. My preference is for Ray as he is the one that started it off for me and I will always prefer the bushcraft side opposed to the survival.

All this is my opinions!
:biggthump
 
G

Ginja

Guest
Now that is news to me! Never heard of Brummy Stokes ... time for a quick Google :)

(PS: in fact, based on experience my favourite would be Mick Tyler from the Hereford Breakaway Survival School - 30 years with the SAS as Lofty Wiseman's "unpublicised" right hand man. Really nice bloke, great sense of humour and mad as a hatter. Keeps you on yer toes ...! Just thought that Ray and Lofty would make a good comparison as they're probably the most famous/TV-friendly of the bunch. Though Chris Ryan is trying his best, bless him ...)
 

Gary

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Apr 17, 2003
2,603
2
57
from Essex
When I see questions like this posed on here I know the editing finger of one moderator or another is poised, ready to delete all I say so..................

Richard Graves

:eek:): :eek:): :eek:):

And

Mors Kochanski

All others are just ............... :yikes: :yikes: :yikes:
 

jakunen

Native
Brummy did a great series where a guy turned up in a brand new Land Rover and EVERY BIT OF KIT he could ever need!

Everyday, Brummy 'nicked' some kit so by the end of the week the guy had made his own shelter, pack, etc.
He taught not only how to survive but how to live with the countryside by being low impact and yet still be very comfortable and well fed.
He covered safety, recovery, foraging, how to use a knofe safely and look after it, how to use and prolong the use of your paid for kit.
Like I said, he combined both aspects.
When you search for info on him, if you find a video or DVD of the series, let me know and I'll dig out me credit card
 

Gary

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Apr 17, 2003
2,603
2
57
from Essex
That was called Lost in the woods martin, good series and much more 'real' than many I could mention.
 

Andy

Native
Dec 31, 2003
1,867
11
38
sheffield
www.freewebs.com
I used to think Ray was the dady, back in the early days. Now there seems to be this big thing about having the kit that he sells which defeats the meaning of it all for me. Though having said that this knife lofty has made isn't cheep either.

I still like all this idea about making baskets and other bits and bobs which lofty doesn't do (to my knowledge)
 

Tony

White bear (Admin)
Admin
Apr 16, 2003
24,129
1
1,875
53
Wales
www.bushcraftuk.com
Gary said:
When I see questions like this posed on here I know the editing finger of one moderator or another is poised, ready to delete all I say so..................

He he, too right. :nana:

It's not just you though, anyone...

This is the sort of thread that deteriorates into slander and bad feeling. You guys seem to have the balance just right, it an opinion thing that's being discussed, just don't turn it into a chance to air personal grievances or let other people draw you into arguments.

The thread is fine, just keep it nice :biggthump
:You_Rock_
 

Tony

White bear (Admin)
Admin
Apr 16, 2003
24,129
1
1,875
53
Wales
www.bushcraftuk.com
I’ve said my Mod bit, now my opinion…For me, right now it’s Ray. I was inspired by Lofty, had his book, did things out of it, it helped me dream of adventure and survival…Ray and his influence over the last years has made it a reality for me… If I had not gone on a Woodlore course I would not know all of you, this place probably would not exist and I would not be doing something I love. Well, probably!

So, for me, Ray, but I’ve huge appreciation for Loft….I even know his sister and hang out with his Nephews!!
:wink:
 

Gary

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Apr 17, 2003
2,603
2
57
from Essex
Forgot to mention Eddie McGee (may he always kindle his fire in that great big forest in the sky) and even before him Jack Hargreaves.

God I am sooooo impressionable!

OK inspiration would be Jack Hargreaves as it was him who first got me out and exploring Epping forest as a sprog.

Guru, Mors Kochanski.
 

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