Bushcraft or Old Fashioned Camping?
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leon-1 said:Northern Bushcraft, great book and the author is a really nice bloke. The next time I am talking with Mors I'll mention that you mentioned his book, he'll probably smile.
If you haven't met the man you really should, there is so much more in that swirling mass of knowledge that sits on his shoulders than you could ever place in one book.
I really hope to attend his summer course this year, since I live relatively close to him and he isn't getting any younger.
Wayland said:
I think this is an important argument. In the National Parks, we concentrate our weekend warriors into well regulated and patrolled campgrounds where they have their flush toilets, pads to park the RV and plugins so the fridge will run. This keeps their impact localized and much easier to manage. I despise the places, but I understand how important they are to allowing people to get out into the outdoors without being everywhere, mangling trees and disturbing the wildlife. Similarly, hiking is allowed only on designated trails to keep the hordes from rampaging throughout the countryside, getting their naive selves into trouble and disturbing nature more than it already is.
So, yeah. You and me not having to denude an evergreen to make our nightly bed is definitely a good thing even though we might want to give it a go once in a while.
I'm 52 years old, I was a seasoned four season hill walker when younger, and only stopped when work and family said I had to. A few years back, I started to collect old camping stoves (hence my avatar) and then got back into camping; my son was then about 14 and I had the time to do this.
After watching Ray Mears, re-reading old books on exploration etc, and with my renewed interest in the outdoors, I found this site, and I've had a fantastic welcome here, thank you all. But when I looked at what many people were talking about, I thought to myself "hang on, we used to do a lot of this in the Boy Scouts back in the 60's" and I'm sure Scouts did this 50+ years prior to that, and other travellers before them.
So, is it bushcraft or old fashioned camping? I would say that much of what is discussed here and practised in the field, is a mix of old skills and old fashioned camping. Remember, if you want to camp on the Brecon Beacons, you need a tent, or a way of supporting a tarp etc, not all of the UK has tree's to give you fuel and shelter. This concept was realised by Welsh people a long time ago, when it was apparent that you could not live and survive on high moors, you needed to live in the valley, where water, fuel, and shelter was more available, and this idea is world wide.
As an individual, I see no problem with using modern kit, and making life more comfortable, what I do see as a problem, is people not respecting the environment they use and the others that do their best to use it in a sensible way, high tec kit or home made/traditional gear.
Well, that's my rant over, sorry if its an over long post
After watching Ray Mears, re-reading old books on exploration etc, and with my renewed interest in the outdoors, I found this site, and I've had a fantastic welcome here, thank you all. But when I looked at what many people were talking about, I thought to myself "hang on, we used to do a lot of this in the Boy Scouts back in the 60's" and I'm sure Scouts did this 50+ years prior to that, and other travellers before them.
So, is it bushcraft or old fashioned camping? I would say that much of what is discussed here and practised in the field, is a mix of old skills and old fashioned camping. Remember, if you want to camp on the Brecon Beacons, you need a tent, or a way of supporting a tarp etc, not all of the UK has tree's to give you fuel and shelter. This concept was realised by Welsh people a long time ago, when it was apparent that you could not live and survive on high moors, you needed to live in the valley, where water, fuel, and shelter was more available, and this idea is world wide.
As an individual, I see no problem with using modern kit, and making life more comfortable, what I do see as a problem, is people not respecting the environment they use and the others that do their best to use it in a sensible way, high tec kit or home made/traditional gear.
Well, that's my rant over, sorry if its an over long post
I think, to a degree, it's about evolution. Making the most of what you have at your disposal. As somebody else said, adapting and moving forward by using gaffer tape to fletch arrows. If I was to go out and create an open fire in the woodland that's left near me, besides that it would be illeagle, once I'd done that a few times I'd have to start cutting down trees in order to get fuel. Likewise for shelter building and making beds etc.
A little carving shouldn't have too much of an impact over time. Once in a while I might be able to get somewhere where I can have a fire. Local Scout sites etc where they have heaps of fire wood donated from local timber yards.
If we all go out practising the traditional skills reguarly we wont have any woods left to practise or enjoy anything in. The kit simply enables us to simply be there.
Some years back at school doing DofE Awards, our leader seemed to refer to much of what we did as Campcraft or Fieldcraft.
BushcraftUK brings us like minded souls together. I'm just glad it's not called CampingFireStartingHuntingForagingCarvingSurvivalAnythingElseOutdoorTypeStuffUK.com
A little carving shouldn't have too much of an impact over time. Once in a while I might be able to get somewhere where I can have a fire. Local Scout sites etc where they have heaps of fire wood donated from local timber yards.
If we all go out practising the traditional skills reguarly we wont have any woods left to practise or enjoy anything in. The kit simply enables us to simply be there.
Some years back at school doing DofE Awards, our leader seemed to refer to much of what we did as Campcraft or Fieldcraft.
BushcraftUK brings us like minded souls together. I'm just glad it's not called CampingFireStartingHuntingForagingCarvingSurvivalAnythingElseOutdoorTypeStuffUK.com
hi all
great thread
any one who thinks that a knife is not a tool should not belong on this site let alone walking about in public (too many sick people around)
wild camping with all mod cons (the best kit) or going native does not matter. the point is that they are all enjoying the great outdoors and we should be as one not divided.....look what happened to hunting with dogs, maybe fishing will be next
boland
great thread
any one who thinks that a knife is not a tool should not belong on this site let alone walking about in public (too many sick people around)
wild camping with all mod cons (the best kit) or going native does not matter. the point is that they are all enjoying the great outdoors and we should be as one not divided.....look what happened to hunting with dogs, maybe fishing will be next
boland
Does it really matter what people take with them or dont take with them,as long as they love and enjoy what they are doing.How far do we have to go to be "bushcrafters"or should the name be changed to primitives.I for one would have time for anyone who is respectful and knowledgable within there enviroment no matter what they where carrying or wearing.
Clayton
Clayton
boland magyar said:
Probably not before they legislate against bushcarft-style camping and the carrying of excessively large knives.
Cheers
stovie said:Who cares!!!!
Get out and enjoy yourself, and don't get so hung up on semantics....
Build a tipi for G@*s sake
I've got to go with Stovie on this one folks.Mike B...
There has been a lot of reference to Mors and his book "Northern Bushcraft" in this thread. Mors has produced a series of booklets subsequent to Northern Bushcraft, during the last ten years. One of those is "The Two Kilogram Survival Kit Field manual" and I thought people might be interested in it's contents....
Mors writes; "The following kit is a home made affair that should compare favourably with any kit presently on the market at a fraction of the cost. It is a compromise between what you can carry and what is available from the natural environment......."
1. Kit Container/cooking pot
2. Knife
3. Hatchet
4. Saw blade for use in a frame saw
5. Components for making snow shoes (lampwick or inner tube, para cord, nails)
6. Components for a pack frame (para cord, nails)
7. Shelter components (3x3m of 2mm clear ploythene, 2x3m rip stop fabric, 1 mylar reflective survival blanket)
8. Metal match/firesteel
9. Subsistance (snare wire, leather pouch and rubber tube for sling shot, hooks, weights, fishing line, a few grams of sea salt and Oxo cubes)
10. Signal mirror and orange smoke bomb
11. 2 heavy duty garbage bags
12. A rip-stop nylon (home sewn) bag
The booklet of course goes into far greater detail, but for that you'll have to buy it
The shelter materials are placed over a framework made from natural materials to form a very heat efficient and comfortable shelter.
[/IMG]
Mors writes; "The following kit is a home made affair that should compare favourably with any kit presently on the market at a fraction of the cost. It is a compromise between what you can carry and what is available from the natural environment......."
1. Kit Container/cooking pot
2. Knife
3. Hatchet
4. Saw blade for use in a frame saw
5. Components for making snow shoes (lampwick or inner tube, para cord, nails)
6. Components for a pack frame (para cord, nails)
7. Shelter components (3x3m of 2mm clear ploythene, 2x3m rip stop fabric, 1 mylar reflective survival blanket)
8. Metal match/firesteel
9. Subsistance (snare wire, leather pouch and rubber tube for sling shot, hooks, weights, fishing line, a few grams of sea salt and Oxo cubes)
10. Signal mirror and orange smoke bomb
11. 2 heavy duty garbage bags
12. A rip-stop nylon (home sewn) bag
The booklet of course goes into far greater detail, but for that you'll have to buy it
The shelter materials are placed over a framework made from natural materials to form a very heat efficient and comfortable shelter.
maddave said:Right !!
Now that's out of the way, why does no one talk about bunny rabbits anymore ??
I blame Elmer Fudd meself !!
Does the name really matter?
Next weekend I am taking a bunch of kids (11/12 year olds) camping without tents, we will probably take some stoves in case the weather is really bad when we arrive, but if possible it will be fires all the way.
We will probably have some rabbits to clean up, but if the farmer doesn't have them then its fish, if the mushroom lady comes then it will be wil fungus, if not a couple of boxes of Tesco economy mushrooms.
Some will have hammocks, some have tarps, others will be using B&Q blue sheets and others bright orange survival bags. If its really, really bad then we might end up sleeping in the store hut.
Some will get their "Outdoors Challenge Award", some the "Outoors Plus Challenge", some will count it as part of "Adventure Challenge" and others may qualify for the "Survival Skills" activity badge.
I think that they will refer to it as "Weekend camp with <Princess>'s Dad" so terms like Bushcraft, Survival etc, may give them some idea of what to expect, but as long as they go home fed and reasonably dry I really don't think that they will mind too much about the name"
(Worst case scenarios is that we end up sleeping in a hut cooking packet food on trangias - THEN its a sleepover )
Next weekend I am taking a bunch of kids (11/12 year olds) camping without tents, we will probably take some stoves in case the weather is really bad when we arrive, but if possible it will be fires all the way.
We will probably have some rabbits to clean up, but if the farmer doesn't have them then its fish, if the mushroom lady comes then it will be wil fungus, if not a couple of boxes of Tesco economy mushrooms.
Some will have hammocks, some have tarps, others will be using B&Q blue sheets and others bright orange survival bags. If its really, really bad then we might end up sleeping in the store hut.
Some will get their "Outdoors Challenge Award", some the "Outoors Plus Challenge", some will count it as part of "Adventure Challenge" and others may qualify for the "Survival Skills" activity badge.
I think that they will refer to it as "Weekend camp with <Princess>'s Dad" so terms like Bushcraft, Survival etc, may give them some idea of what to expect, but as long as they go home fed and reasonably dry I really don't think that they will mind too much about the name"
(Worst case scenarios is that we end up sleeping in a hut cooking packet food on trangias - THEN its a sleepover
)
Wayland said:
Yes, I hope so......
My daughter jsut pointed out one little msitake in the joining instructions. They say 17:00 hours not 7PM, no wonder the little dears were asking tonight if Friday dinner was provided!!
I need to talk to the lad who typed up the forms :twak:
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