Access For All

[JonathanD]

no,..cos that shifting the responsibility to them....

Jonathans idea is that YOU are the rep, and potentially at risk of your agreements being abused by irresponsible campers,..(thats gonna be fired at you too, so have a good answer)

the easier the agreement is to keep , the less risk for you.

Yeah, if you can answer the question and accept that transgresions can and will happen, it sounds much better than you telling them "I'll make sure that doesn't happen" as they know from experience that it does. It just shows that you have again, gone deeper into the possibility and are very serious about going about it in teh correct way. It's little things like that that can make all the difference.

 

[Siberianfury]

That would be of great help, but go deeper. Go into the place and make notes of everything you can. First hand observations and knowledge will put the ball firmly in your court and you won't have to rely on third party information that may be incorrect. Always investigate any info you get, by going out and backing it up yourself. That impresses people like them and when you meet them, you'll be talking with first hand experience which always comes over better and will make you more confident in your pitch.

going deeper into the flora and fauna ect of every woodland they have is some task!

as regards to raikeys comment again this is something to be looked into further, we're fully prepared to be responsibile for putting this/ seeing this through however any input from the community is going to be a great help the approach i wanted to take with this was to represent the forums/ bushcraft community in their ideals and outline a few things we can do in their land with permission to do so,

just seeking advice so the oppourtunity is not lost due to making a few c*** ups

 

[JonathanD]

going deeper into the flora and fauna ect of every woodland they have is some task!

It is, but once a few sites, or a site has been proposed by them, then do that. If you know what woodlands they own in an area, find out where the rare species are, and which sites have SSI.

As long as you tick all their boxes and tehn go a little further to boost your rep, you'll build firm foundations and that'll help you all the more when you are up and running.

I'll send you a few of the propasals I have to write up to gain access and protect areas, that should help you. It's aboviously from a herpetological and conservation point of view, but the end result isn't too dissimilar from what you are trying to achieve and shows what they like to look for.

 

[Siberianfury]

I'll send you a few of the propasals I have to write up to gain access and protect areas, that should help you. It's aboviously from a herpetological and conservation point of view, but the end result isn't too dissimilar from what you are trying to achieve and shows what they like to look for.

that would be fantastic the woodlands trust have posted whether their sites are ssi or aonb ect so this would save some time and we were orginally looking into one local woods, beacon hill nr shepton mallet, but seeing their interest in the proposal to start with we decided to see what we could do as regards to opening up other oppourtunitys

 

[Siberianfury]

Good on you for attempting this. For ideas etc have you looked at the Land Reform (Scotland)Act or the Scottish Outdoor Code? These both contain good snippets of things that make us, responsible - and thats what many land owners will want, people to act responsible. One area you may want to think about is coastal access too, as much of the coast is privately owned, in as much as the fore shore or is it beach or whatever it's called, so for folks south of the border access to the water isn't as simple or legal as up here.?

Just a couple of thoughts, hope everything goes well for you!

hey just found this usefull snippet, not sure if you know this already but if this was law here we would be laughing... http://www.mcofs.org.uk/assets/pdfs/wildcamping.pdf

 

[vizsla]

one thing to remember is although some bushcrafters just like to camp out with a fire, for most that is just a small part as many are as good and experienced as any conservationist,taking great care in what they do, by reconising resources and supply's and only using if, and in a way that will benefit the tree or whatever may be supplying that resource, but certainly not causing any longterm damage by overtaking or not taking correctly whether it be dead standing wood for the fire or sap from a live tree.
by giving people the freedom to rohm and camp it gives us chance to learn more about how to do things correctly and also more about the conservation point of view, rather than feeling like you should't be there and you doing something you shoudn't be, lets turn what we do into a positive thing.
just my thoughts cheers

 

[JonathanD]

one thing to remember is although some bushcrafters just like to camp out with a fire, for most that is just a small part as many are as good and experienced as any conservationist,taking great care in what they do, by reconising resources and supply's and only using if, and in a way that will benefit the tree or whatever may be supplying that resource, but certainly not causing any longterm damage by overtaking or not taking correctly whether it be dead standing wood for the fire or sap from a live tree.
by giving people the freedom to rohm and camp it gives us chance to learn more about how to do things correctly and also more about the conservation point of view, rather than feeling like you should't be there and you doing something you shoudn't be, lets turn what we do into a positive thing.
just my thoughts cheers

Thing is, when you have a lot of bushcrafters doing the same thing, however responsible they are, loads of people all taking dead standing and tapping trees in one area, will drastically affect that place. It's a case of numbers, not responsibility. That too must be considered.

 

[vizsla]

your right jonathan but like i say thats allways gona be the problem, myself i often take supplys of my own wood with me even tho theres plenty about, but thats because i no its the right thing to do, im sure your the same but theres always gona be people that arnt, but then theres also always gona be people that camp in your favorite wood and leave fires smouldering and beer cans etc everywere. but thats same as everything in life theres always gona some one thats ruins it for everyone, if they manage to achieve what there trying to do and then the following week some kids set fire to some ancient trees, were will the fingers be pointed. it will have to work on trust, or failing that we all go through a check to make sure were responsible, and then we get a members card but i cant see that hapening.
that took some donig mate think my beds calling
cheers

 

[Zingmo]

I have to say this is a brilliant idea. I would suggest a two way exchange - what we want is a place to sit by a fire and whittle a spoon (that is bushcraft isn't it?). I've just had a quick squint at their website and they seem to want to know what's going on in their woods.
They like pictures - we can do that; the evidence is all over this forum.
They like folk to report what species they have spotted - we can do that; and the members of this forum include experts in many fields (like JonD).
They like help logging the change of the seasons - we can do that; albeit in handmade leather-bound journals!
They like people to spot the ancient trees - we could check on them regularly.
And we could do so much more. If they have yahoos "camping" innappropriately they won't know about it until they stumble across the wreckage. Responsible bushcrafters could have the local ranger/warden's phone number on their permit and would be able to report anything they found. If we encountered others using the woods we can offer advice and encourage them to "leave no trace"

Getting a permit should mean more than just buying a ticket to camp - it should be joining forces with the WT to help look after the woodlands.

I would suggest a central register of those who have agreed to a set of expectations and behaviours; only signatories could hold a permit and they would be responsible for the behavoiur of the group. The primary comeback for any misdemeanors would be to be removed from that register.

Z

 

[Rumi]

Brilliant Idea..

Let me for one moment play devils advocate..

With regards to management, there has to be some level of supervision and control of what goes on when.

With regards to permits and use of land for fire making, foraging etc, again who will ultimately have control and supervise/ even in some cases police this. For example I do a lot of bc in semi urban environments, if I have a fire, at the end of my stay I make sure I leave no trace of the fact that that is what I have done. Why, because other people are not so respectful of nature and will have a fire and leave all their crap lying around, tear down branches to burn and generally trash the place..

Perhaps a precondition of receiving a license would be an agreement to leave no trace. I agree that this places an additional burden on the bc practitioner, but it also ensures that beautiful places stay as such. I generally find that people don't tend to have fires in the woods unless they see that others have before them, its strange really.

Bringing your own fire wood is all very well, though I dont take a vehicle when I go bush, a small pack, sleeping bag and what I stand up in, thats it, I cant drag a boot full of logs. What land owners want to know is that the proposal is well tthought out, risk assessed, who will take responsibility and what it is not going to cost THEM.

 

[Bush Matt]

Good work, I've always wondered who owns the woods driving out of London on the M1 and the answer for two of them is woodland trust - any overnight access would be brilliant.

 

[_mark_]

Wood stores.

 

[Ph34r]

what he said,..



dont pounce in there with your camo bandana on and a 8 inch blade strapped to your leg.

I agree,It should be atleast 13"

All jokes aside though, it's a great idea.

 

[grimstead]

great ideas guys hope it go well for you all the best just thinking tho for a representation why not try and get mr mears involved he's now well known in the public eye more than likely is people will say no but its worth a try

all the best

mark

 

[georann]

Couldn't agree more with zingmo!
Regarding RM I would actually disagree because it would get lots of publicity and although the general ramblers rights might be expanded, too many people will be drawn in and it wouldnt work as they wont respect the environment as much. Would definitely be up for keeping a record for the trust and helping act as a warden when I wasx out. As far as helping, Im under 18 so might not be as useful to your campaign but Im a Scout Young Leader so if you want to get youth involved I can help with that, or as an A-level English student I dont mind helping draft letters etc for you. Whatever I can do, Im behind this plan all the way!

ATB
Dan

 

[jonajuna]

fingers crossed, but i will be amazed 9and its been known before! ) if the woodland trust go for it. i'm a member and i know that they have a great many problems caused by "campers" and those that run free parties on their land

but then again, having a formal agreement with people like us may well offer a degree of protection for their woods.

its something i looked at many moons ago by being on their volunteer list to be a warden for them, sadly, time is an enemy and there are few woods near me that "need" volunteer wardens.

good luck Josh, shout me if you need some help.

 

[SMARTY]

Just a thought. Why does it have to be a wood? If you are going to take your own fire wood, stoves etc, could this be done in a field? Out here we can camp anywhere in the desert. We take our own fire wood and water.

 

[sapper1]

Just a thought. Why does it have to be a wood? If you are going to take your own fire wood, stoves etc, could this be done in a field? Out here we can camp anywhere in the desert. We take our own fire wood and water.

The voice of reason and common sense.Careful you may upset a few for practicing bushcraft in a place that's not woodland

 

[SMARTY]

Rename it to woodcraft maybe!

 

[jonajuna]

while camping in the desert is fantastic in itself (aussie outback)... woodland camping is a special thing

there is no shortage of camp-sites that are no more than fields, many where you can have a fire too and sit and whittle all day if you like

but to sleep out as northern Europeans are 'meant' to live, amongst the trees, is a different league