1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Hey Guest, We're having our annual Winter Moot and we'd love you to come. PLEASE LOOK HERE to secure your place and get more information.
    For forum threads CLICK HERE
    Dismiss Notice

Is a leatherman skeletool legal carry?

Discussion in 'Edged Tools' started by lostplanet, Jan 28, 2019.

  1. Paul_B

    Paul_B Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2008
    Messages:
    3,916
    Likes Received:
    408
    Location:
    Lancashire
    Many a truth in jest.

    This sums up my view. If you're discreet with the knife or multitool and don't give anyone a reason to be concerned then it would take a police officer with x-ray vision to see it and ping you for carrying it.

    My habit is to carry an opinel knife in my rucksack on walks. I even carry it like that around town before or after the walk. Town being Ambleside or Keswick near where I'm walking.

    Now I just look like a walker, which is what I am. If I got searched then I have food with me or did have food. The knife is to cut food. Tupperware box with the remains of lunch justifies the knife IMHO.

    A bike kit includes a SAK cyber tool. It's left in a stuff sack in a pannier or other bag on my bike. Hard to see but justified by the pliers and potentially the need to cut things like cable ties. Whilst I won't have a direct need for it the fact my transport is a bike there's enough parts that might need a knife to repair enough to get home.

    Both situations have slightly questional reasons to justify carrying the knives involved. That is only a risk of I give someone a cause to discover the knife. Being someone who gives off the impression of law abidence apparently I just don't give the police a reason to stop me and search me. If they ever did I'd try the justification. That is only a back up to discretion.

    Isn't that approach appropriate?
     
  2. sunndog

    sunndog Full Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2014
    Messages:
    3,336
    Likes Received:
    348
    Location:
    derbyshire
    folks do get hung up on this. Lock knives, fixed blade knives are fine if you have a reason to use them.....sub 3" non lockers are even more fine

    Sounds alright when you put it like that doesnt it?


    Your mileage may vary of course but i refuse to make this law into a big deal in my head.
    ive carried a knife of various different types including belt knives......on a belt. Every day for most of my life. No copper has ever searched me
    and that includes being taken to the local station in a police car to be interviewed, and yes i had a lock knife in my pocket


    I'm chosing to believe this 'good reason' qualifier is meant as an extra offence they can charge chavs and scumbags with when found with a knife and cant even bloody think of a reason they have it
     
    Janne likes this.
  3. Woody110

    Woody110 Mod
    Mod

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2009
    Messages:
    261
    Likes Received:
    73
    Location:
    Leeds, Yorkshire
    The offence actually comes under Section 139 of the criminal justice act 1988, and the correct offence working is “offence of having artical with blade or point in a public place”
    A folding knife with a sub 3” blade doesn’t fall into this.
    It is for all knives which do not come under prohibited weapons. In this case a lock knife.

    If you are found guilty at court, and receive a custodial sentence, it’s a minimum of 6 months inside (if over 18 when offence committed, and if under 18 at time of offence, but over 18 on conviction, it’s a minimum of 4 months community order)
     
  4. Paul_B

    Paul_B Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2008
    Messages:
    3,916
    Likes Received:
    408
    Location:
    Lancashire
    Curious, how many on here have been charged with this offence?
     
  5. nunzionuk

    nunzionuk Full Member

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2010
    Messages:
    863
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Essex, UK
    I've been stopped once, in the last 40 years. I had an EDC and Multitool in my bag, along with other tools (wirecutters/screwdrivers) as I worked in a datacenter, so they was part of the job tools... neither was taken from me, as I was upfront about having them, had them in a secured inside pocket of my bag, and a valid reason to have them on me.
     
    #45 nunzionuk, Jan 30, 2019
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 30, 2019
  6. Woody110

    Woody110 Mod
    Mod

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2009
    Messages:
    261
    Likes Received:
    73
    Location:
    Leeds, Yorkshire
    Probably none, however doesn’t mean that you couldn’t be. In this day and age of the papers blowing everything out of proportion.
     
  7. Stew

    Stew Bushcrafter through and through

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2003
    Messages:
    5,196
    Likes Received:
    311
    Location:
    Aylesbury
    If I ever get charged I'm just going to say that some bloke on the internet said I would be alright. :D I'm sure it'll see me right.
     
    Woody110, Essexman and Janne like this.
  8. Minotaur

    Minotaur Native

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2005
    Messages:
    1,064
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Birmingham
    I carry a Leather man Ti as part of my bike tool kit. The reasonable excuse goes like this, it has a lot of tools including a pair of pliers in one tool and I do not leave something with my bike which is worth a third of the value of the bike which is why the Garmin is in the bag as well.
    I have realised that when cycling to work I have 4 knifes on me! I have a key ring blade, a rough rider 2 blade clasp knife, a swiss army huntsman (It lives in my bag) as well as the leather-man.
     
  9. C_Claycomb

    Mod

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2003
    Messages:
    5,461
    Likes Received:
    549
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    So you are carrying a "fixed" blade while cycling to work because it comes bundled with other useful tools which you may need to work on the bike. When you get to work, you continue to carry your "fixed" blade, not because your work requires a knife that does not fold, but because the knife (and bundled tools) are too expensive to leave with your bike?

    What have I not understood?

    I must be misreading your post because while that makes logical sense taken on its own, it doesn't make sense to me within my understanding of the present legal situation.

    Chris

    Addendum.
    While getting stopped is unlikely for most of us, due to a number of factors, it is still the freak occurrences that bear remembering. Mistaken identity, paranoid members of the public, getting into a heated argument in public, or in this case, being picked at random for a vehicle search, wrong place, wrong time.

    From 2004. Yes, he had a baton too, but it read as though the knife would have been enough on its own, even 15 years ago.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment...-penknife.-Youre-going-down-mate-he-said.html

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/4379766.stm
     
    #49 C_Claycomb, Feb 2, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2019
    Janne likes this.
  10. Janne

    Janne M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Messages:
    12,215
    Likes Received:
    2,201
    Location:
    Grand Cayman, Norway, Sweden
    C_clay makes sense here. Minotaur, you are a perfect canditate to get some leasure time courtesy of the Queen.....

    I always have had a fixed blade in the tool roll in every car we own and have owned, but they are stashed away.
    Plus an axe.

    4 blades on your bod sounds like potential trouble with the Law...

    If I may ask, Minotaur, if you should be stoppped and searched, what would be your excuse?
     
  11. Stew

    Stew Bushcrafter through and through

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2003
    Messages:
    5,196
    Likes Received:
    311
    Location:
    Aylesbury
    A copper may wonder why you didn't buy the bladeless fuse that leatherman made or even one of the juice models that have a slipjoint blade.

    Justifying the blade because it comes with other tools is an interesting excuse.
     
  12. Wildgoose

    Wildgoose Full Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2012
    Messages:
    237
    Likes Received:
    34
    Location:
    Middlesex
    I originally wrote post about the incident reported in the telegraph but removed it as it was likely to derail the thread and start a new discussion.

    Whenever there is a arrest horror story in the press such as “I was arrested for having a knife key ring” we are only hearing one side of the story, which is often written by the aggrieved party.
     
    #52 Wildgoose, Feb 2, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2019
    Janne likes this.
  13. Paul_B

    Paul_B Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2008
    Messages:
    3,916
    Likes Received:
    408
    Location:
    Lancashire
    You can say what you like but if you haven't a good reason to carry a knife then why carry it? If you have a good reason then what are the chances of being charged?
     
  14. Janne

    Janne M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Messages:
    12,215
    Likes Received:
    2,201
    Location:
    Grand Cayman, Norway, Sweden
    This is a similar answer to another thread, to a different scenario.

    Why not go to your police station, explain the situation and have a chat? Maybe return and show the blade you want to carry in your backpack?
    This way you get a feel for what they think, and if they OK the blade, and you get searched by the police, you can mention it was OK’d?
     
  15. Jared

    Jared Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2005
    Messages:
    2,497
    Likes Received:
    76
    Location:
    Wales
    Leatherman's current knifeless model is the EDC Rebar.
     
  16. C_Claycomb

    Mod

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2003
    Messages:
    5,461
    Likes Received:
    549
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    Once upon a time I did go to a police station and ask about the law on carrying a locking knife. This was back in 1999, long before the headlines were strewn with knife crime and stabbings, and the office at the desk clearly could not grasp why anyone would ever want or need to carry a knife for any legal reason. He was not able to explain the law (CJA 1988 & case law interpretation of "folding", which is what I had so nearly run-afoul of). It was easier for him to tell me "don't carry", which is exactly what he did.

    Might be interesting to go locally and see if one could get a feel for the response, but I would not expect the outcome to be positive, and I wouldn't take anything I didn't want to have confiscated.

    Sadly, there is no legal defence to carrying a knife that says "Its okay because I asked PC Smith six months ago and he said it would be fine."

    Actually, I am not sure that "I am taking this knife to show the police to find out if it is legal to carry to work." would be a good reason for carrying said knife through town either
    :cool3:
     
    Essexman and Wildgoose like this.
  17. Wildgoose

    Wildgoose Full Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2012
    Messages:
    237
    Likes Received:
    34
    Location:
    Middlesex
    In general there are too many possible scenarios and variables to answer the question “would this be ok to carry?”

    Location, time of day, terror threat, attitude (of you and the police, crime hotspot?, where and how you were carrying it.
    Endless possibilities.

    A police officer or lawyer would probably say that it depends on the circumstance at the time of the stop. You will never find any authority who can give a permission to carry, no such authority exists.
     
  18. Fadcode

    Fadcode Full Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2016
    Messages:
    2,077
    Likes Received:
    460
    Location:
    Cornwall
    C Claycomb
    Actually, I am not sure that "I am taking this knife to show the police to find out if it is legal to carry to work." would be a good reason for carrying said knife through town either

    you are probably right on this although the Official Government Website, advises that if you are not sure about carrying a certain knife, they advise you to go to the Police Station and ask them.(its not clear whether you should take the knife with you)

    Quote from website.https://www.gov.uk/buying-carrying-knives
    Contact your local police to check if a knife or weapon is illegal.

    Now if you did this and the Police confiscated the knife and actually charged you for having the knife in your possession in public, I doubt very much that the CPS would proceed with the charge, as you were actually following the correct procedure as advised by the Government, and if they did take you to court and you won, this would cause so much embarrassment to the CPS and the Government, which is why they would probably not proceed.

    Now saying that the other thing to take into consideration is that the Police would now be aware that you have knives at your home, which is not an ideal situation to be in.so in a way its a catch 22 situation.
     
  19. daveO

    daveO Native

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2009
    Messages:
    1,326
    Likes Received:
    405
    Location:
    South Wales
    Technically the locking saw blade on that model is still illegal. I think even the awl is pushing the legal carry status too.
     
  20. daveO

    daveO Native

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2009
    Messages:
    1,326
    Likes Received:
    405
    Location:
    South Wales
    Just for clarification, if you look at the reports that aren't written from the defendant's perspective it does look like he's a total bottom and brought the arrest on himself through his rather jumped up attitude.
     
    Wildgoose likes this.

Share This Page