Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'Bushcraft and survival skills' started by falling rain, Mar 19, 2013.
I agree. http://www.ted.com/talks/andrew_mwenda_takes_a_new_look_at_africa.html
Hurray, Dutch subs
Oh, I think they're automatic.
http://www.azdhs.gov/phs/oids/epi/disease/waterborne/list.htm The link gives a list of waterborne pathogens but would really like to know if anyone knows of a chart or list as to what temperature the different pathogens are killed at. Some are more resilient than others but I believe most are killed by the time the water gets to 70c or there abouts, so boiling water (so it's bubbling) will obviously cover that as it will of course be 100c
"Boiling kills all bacteria and viruses immediately."
"All microorganisms are killed within seconds as the temperature passes 55-70 C"
Hi Falling Rain,
There's some good info here including tables for temp and duration to inactivate waterbourne pathogens. LINK
Well current Environmental Health regulations state that for food to be rendered safe from bacteria a core temperature of 75c must be reached in initial cooking, and a core temp of 82c for reheating.
So 82c is the golden number here, however barring taking a temperature probe out with you its going to be difficult to be sure this has been achieved. I was taught to bring the water to a rolling boil for a moment then allow to cool, to avoid unnecessary wastage.
The idea that natives in a certain area can just boil water isn't always practical. They would completely denude an area of wood in no time, filtration and uv treatment is the answer. Vie heard that Africa burns over a billion litres of kerosene a year just for lighting, that's just a little flame to see by. Imagine the energy used to boil all their drinking water. "Knife fan" hit the nail on the head by the way. No amount of aid will change things in a meaningful way.
Thanks Goatboy, that's a great link. Very interesting and lots of info. Just what I was after, and much appreciated. Interesting to see Cholera can be destroyed at 60c for 10 minutes or 10 seconds at 100c......Nice one.
Yes if it's bubbling, it's boiling! and must have passed the magic 82c - On Goatboys link it says hepatitis A needs a much higher temperature to be killed than most of the others - 98c
1. To dig a gypsy well, you need to know that it's smart to do it. Most people living under such circumstances have little or no education in anything. Thats why they are this poor in the first place.
2. If the more afluent in those contries pay tax at all, corruption normally see to that none or very little of that money filters down to the poorest in the society.
I used to work for the UN and other NGO's in Africa, middle east and Asia...
Wow that's high. Even in the UK there are a few places where water boils below that.
On the fuel front there are folk who are making commercial success work for third world countries in small way. The designers of the Frontier Stove and the Jompy designed them to help in third world and disaster areas where fuel will be at a premium. They are fuel efficient ways of heating, cooking and boiling water so that pressure is taken off of fuel supply. And I believe that commercial sales go to help these projects. Education and innovation as well as investment in infrastructure are the best ways to help rather than a sticking plaster of materials. It's like the old addage "Give a man a fish and he eats for a day, give him a net and teach him to fish and he'll feed his family forever." Corny but rings very true. Although as my pals wife says, "Teach him to fish and get peace every weekend!"
As an aside I don't know if any of you saw these LINK A great idea for shelter which again will save of bulk materials and heating fuel.
That's a great idea for some areas but does rely on an awful lot of water.
Indeed ... don't start me off or I'll geet thrown out for being political !!!
Here is a calculator for boiling points against altitude and barometric pressure.
Don't forget that killing things is a time AND temperature function. There will be a minimum temperature but also a time at that temperature. Higher temperatures for a shorter time also works. This is the principal behind Pasteurisation. UHT milk is given something like 138°C for a minimum of two seconds. Kills most of the bugs but too short a time to curdle the milk.
Thus the bringing to a rolling boil means that the bug has probably been above the required temperature, e.g. 82ºC, for long enough to kill. Just going to a temperature for a short time will not do it.
I have to agree, my wife also works for Oxfam International!
'Edited'.... Decided it was off thread......
Big bubbles= no troubles. Bring water to a rolling boil and all the nasties are kaput !! Simples
Why do we not hear about birth control in these third world countries coupled with aid whilst attending to current problems. It seems to me the large families in drought/famine areas are a big part of the problem. (for the avoidance of any doubt here I am not talking about eugenics and would welcome birth control world wide).
Over population is the elephant in the room and I'm not sure Oxfam (or the other charities I know of) for example, addresses this global problem.
I know some one will say they have large families to have security in old age, but the number of infant deaths is to me Victorian. Discuss.