London riots

[kennyboy]

Riots in London a year before the Olympics???
Just seems to me that this is all too convenient.
This isn't a spontanious reaction to the shooting of a hood. It's a well organised, country wide, plan that has
been long in the planning.
Taking that these 'rioters' couldn't organise a fart in a bean factory, the question is who is behind it all.
When the smoke clears expect lots of new 'measures', for your safety, from your Government.

 

[MartinK9]

On BBC News 24 just seen a Policeperson finally use their baton on a looter wearing a hoody in Manchester.

And on Sky a policedog got a lovebite in.... nice one.

About time.

 

[Shambling Shaman]

the local Bobby having a "brew" (I assume you mean an beer)

A brew in the UK normally refers to a cup to tea.

 

[Shambling Shaman]

Riots in London a year before the Olympics???
Just seems to me that this is all too convenient.
This isn't a spontanious reaction to the shooting of a hood. It's a well organised, country wide, plan that has
been long in the planning.
Taking that these 'rioters' couldn't organise a fart in a bean factory, the question is who is behind it all.
When the smoke clears expect lots of new 'measures', for your safety, from your Government.

Sadly I have to agree, let us not forget "civil enforcement officers"

And sadly any "New security measures" for are "Safety" will most likely remove yet more freedoms,,,

 

[Retired Member southey]

Southey it may well be a cultural difference here. I'm not sure. What a cop on patrol does is stop to eat a meal or use the restroom (all authorized breaks, no alcohol allowed) All restaurants (common street type anyway, not the posh ones) give minor discounts (usually just free coffee or other non alcoholic beverages) The cop on the beat is just doing as any citizen and choosing to have his meal where he can best afford to. Remember also that I'm not talking about a pub; the type restaurant I'm talking about would be most like a "Little Chef", Mcdonald's, or something similar. Realize that by doing so he is not only maintaining a presence (a visible presence) in the community but he is building a rapport with the community. And he desperately needs that rapport, trust and support to effectively do his job. Also remember what I said about most officers' habit of leaving a tip worth at least the same or greater value that any discount. He's really not receiving anything in the end.

Apart from what you said about the local Bobby having a "brew" (I assume you mean an beer) there is no difference in our stopping for a meal or said Bobby (assuming the Bobby gets an authorized meal break of course) stopping for a meal; although I do remember that there are fewer such restaurants in the UK and, no, a pub would not be acceptable here either.

Of course motives and public perception are paramount. If the public perceived it as corruption it would have to be stopped immediately. But they don't see it that way here. No more than they think of senior discounts or military discount (which are more widespread than restaurants) to be corrupt. In fact the public appreciate the presence in places they frequent (well except for the criminal element they do)

Hahaha sorry dude I ment a cup of tea, Yup the best intel is always from the people who spend there days looking at who is coming through there shop\cafe, if your gonna stop and chat may as well make a tasty stop,

 

[ged]

...You only go to the station (assuming there is actually a station in your patrol zone) for business reasons. I've spent weeks without ever going to the station. Eating with the public in a public restaurant maintains a police presence.

Three stories. I'm not trying to take a sideways swipe with this, just saying how I felt when I've unexpectedly met armed police in different circumstances. The point is that in the UK, the police generally aren't armed (at least not with firearms) and I think most of them like it that way. I certainly do.

Many years ago I was heading for America on business. It wasn't long after http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lufthansa_Flight_181. I walked into the terminal at Heathrow and straightaway bumped into two policemen packing MP5s. To say I was shocked would be understating things quite a bit. They looked at me and asked me if I was all right. I explained that it had been a shock to see them armed as they were and I said that I didn't like it at all. They said that they didn't like it either.

Not so long after that I was eating breakfast in a hotel restaurant, I think it was in Chicago. There was a huge round table nearby, with nobody sitting at it. Just after I ordered my breakfast, eight or ten policemen walked in and sat at the table. Well, that's not exactly what happened. First of all they stood around the table and took off all their weapons, sprays, cuffs and various other uncomfortable paraphernalia and made a huge pile of it right there in the middle of the table. Then they sat down and started drinking the coffee which had magically appeared as if they did it every day. They probably did. It put me off eating, and even open heart surgery wouldn't do that to me.

Not so long ago I was heading south through France. I stopped for a rest at one of the service stops and went to the shop to get a sandwich. When I came out my van was surrounded by armed police. I was surprised that they'd singled my van out like that but it turned out it wasn't my van that they were interested in, it was one parked a few yards away. I had my camera with me so I held it up to take a photo. Big mistake. A couple of chaps carrying G2s ran towards me shouting "no pictures". It's surprising how obedient you can be when that sort of thing happens, I remember thinking later that I could easily have just pressed the shutter release a few times without sighting the, er, shots and they'd never have known. But I didn't, I just did exactly what they said.

Anyway the point is that I'm very happy to have a high profile police presence, but a lot less happy about it if they're armed.

 

[Corso]

That will mostly be a cultural thing - I'd have no prolem having armed officiers if the law abiding general populus are allowed to carry firearms too...

 

[Retired Member southey]

I think so too, though having spent most of my life minus a 6 year gap working a security guard after school, Ive grown up living on mod property where its the norm to see armed peeps cutting about, and spending alot of time on Salisbury Plain as a kid and adult you get used to finding random guys and gals popping up out of bushes heavily armed and looking warry

 

[Bushwhacker]

Riots in London a year before the Olympics???
Just seems to me that this is all too convenient.
This isn't a spontanious reaction to the shooting of a hood. It's a well organised, country wide, plan that has
been long in the planning.
Taking that these 'rioters' couldn't organise a fart in a bean factory, the question is who is behind it all.
When the smoke clears expect lots of new 'measures', for your safety, from your Government.

Don't worry, David Icke will be here in a minute.

"It wuz the lizzerds wat dun it"

 

[BillyBlade]

Riots in London a year before the Olympics???
Just seems to me that this is all too convenient.
This isn't a spontanious reaction to the shooting of a hood. It's a well organised, country wide, plan that has
been long in the planning.
Taking that these 'rioters' couldn't organise a fart in a bean factory, the question is who is behind it all.
When the smoke clears expect lots of new 'measures', for your safety, from your Government.

Disagree. Blackberry mesaging etc, which is comms secure sadly, means that rabbles can be in touch with each other and co-ordinate attacks very easily.

As for the 'couldn't organise' angle, please don't for a moment think that intelligence is the same as the feral urban skills these hoodrats have. It's not, these guys are more streetwise than 99% of posters on this board I'll wager. The country wide angle is just copycats chiming in as they have no fear of meaningfull retribution from a castrated judicial system.

I don't for one moment think the Government is behind, nor orchestrating, anything. My tinfoil hat stays firmly in its locker.

 

[Shambling Shaman]

I don't for one moment think the Government is behind, nor orchestrating, anything.

I dont think there doing it, but they WILL use it no doubt!

 

[GordonM]

That will mostly be a cultural thing - I'd have no prolem having armed officiers if the law abiding general populus are allowed to carry firearms too...

+1

Ged - Thanks for sharing your views. It is very good to view it from your perspective, an eye opener for me.

Gordy

 

[The Lord Poncho]

i am surprised to be honest martin, pleasantly so, i'm a little bit saddened though that there aren't more of the big name high street stores on there.

stuart

To be honest, whilst i qualify for military discounts (and certainly wouldn't turn them down!), I'm not really sure why they are handed out? Members of the forces aren't a charity, they are doing a job like anyone else employed in the country. I'm sure there are exceptions, but the reason 99% of the members of the armed forces joined up is not driven by a burning urge to help the world and those less fortunate than themselves, but to get a steady job (and lets not forget that the vast majority of our armed forces comprise those individuals with arguably fewer employment choices than the average person), a job that gives them respect amongst their communities, an opportunity for an interesting and adventurous career, and a springboard to a step change in their life. Yes there are times when the job is very dangerous, and maybe gives a little more 'adventure' than they hoped, but they signed up to the life knowing the risks. The risks are small (risk= magnitude of impact [high] x likelihood of occurrence [very low]) and the majority of time when not deployed, the life and workload is light in comparison to many civilian jobs. I'm not sure this adds up to an argument for widespread discounts.

Giving discounts to charity workers, and volunteers on the other hand should be infinitely more prevalent, and if so, would send a clear message that these people are valued. When given the option, i always use my Scout discount rather than my military discount.

As an aside (and more on topic!), my family and I spent Monday night looking out of our kitchen window at the flames and smoke from the burning furniture store in Croydon, and the shouting 100m down the street associated with the shooting of that chap. We had a couple of grab bags with important documents, food, water, clothes and cash ready to go by the door in case the worst happened!

 

[Retired Member southey]

We as a service family really do appreciate the discounts, especially now with single income, it does make a little difference,

 

[GordonM]

We had a couple of grab bags with important documents, food, water, clothes and cash ready to go by the door in case the worst happened!

A very good justification to have a grab bag or quick exit bag. TLP, I am curious as to what your exit criteria might have been / is under your circumstances. Stay safe mate!

Gordy

 

[Frogo]

RIP Broken Britain.. You went soft on discipline!.. You went soft on immigration! You went soft on crime.. Parents were told.. 'No you can't smack the kids'....Teachers were prevented from chastising kids in schools.. The police couldn't clip a troublemaker round the ear.. Kids had rights blah blah blah.. Well done Britain..You shall reap what you sow.. We have lost a whole generation!!


Not my words but very true.

 

[Retired Member southey]

Is the current lost generation me at 32 or my kids at 2?

 

[santaman2000]

To be honest, whilst i qualify for military discounts (and certainly wouldn't turn them down!), I'm not really sure why they are handed out?...

It's been my experience that most businesses that offer a military discount are actually located near a military installation (and sometimes either owned or managed by military veterans) These businesses obviously are dependent on military patronage. The reason for the discounts then is twofold. It obviously is a way to say, "Thank you for your service" but it is also a business decision; a way to say, "Thank you for being my customer, please come in and buy from me rather than from my competition."

 

[santaman2000]

...Many years ago I was heading for America on business. It wasn't long after http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lufthansa_Flight_181. I walked into the terminal at Heathrow and straightaway bumped into two policemen packing MP5s...

I was eating breakfast in a hotel restaurant, I think it was in Chicago. There was a huge round table nearby, with nobody sitting at it. Just after I ordered my breakfast, eight or ten policemen walked in and sat at the table. Well, that's not exactly what happened. First of all they stood around the table and took off all their weapons, sprays, cuffs and various other uncomfortable paraphernalia and made a huge pile of it right there in the middle of the table. Then they sat down and started drinking the coffee...

As to the first incident, I passed through Heathrow and Gatwick airport several times before the flight 181 incident and saw police with MP5s. I too was a bit surprised and (since at that time there had been no high profile incidents) a bit at a loss as to why. I just blew it off thinking they probably had access to intelligence that I didn't.

As to the officers in Chicago that's another matter. I cain't speak for their (or any Chicago officers) habits of frequenting any particular establishment. However! Taking their weapons off is definitely grounds for firing (if they survive a sudden attack) by any department in the country. I would also have to ask that (if as you say the reason was for their comfort) did they also take off their shirts so they could tale off the bulletproof vest that every American officer wears? Did they take off their concealed back-up guns?

 

[milius2]

What about this? An interview gone wrong

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biJgILxGK0o