Bog Iron

[Toddy]

I do a lot of dyeing using native plants. I use three mordants; alum, coppper and iron.
I've been putting together my notes on iron, and realised that I hadn't ever looked into the other uses for bog iron. The iron rich water, used as my mordant soak, works fine for natural dyeing, but, it can also end up forming nodules of bog iron ore.

Historically we know that these were smelted and worked to make knives, etc., and since the ore is rich in silicates the finished tools end up with a protective glassy coating that actually preserves them against rust.

One link but loads more out there.

http://www.thegenieslamp.com/bogiron/

cheers,
Toddy

 

[jdlenton]

thats cool Toddy never heard of that before

 

[Toddy]

Best bit is that it doesn't need to reach the temperatures that smelting ordinary iron ore needs
Technically, this stuff can be relatively easily worked in a fire with a good going draught like the Dakota firepit
It also makes really good tools

You know the tales of Excalibur, the sword from the stone ? that had to be returned to the Lady of the Lake ? I did hear an archaeometalurgist suggest that the tale was a muddled rendition of the reality of the sword's creation, that the stone was the casting mould and the lake was where the iron had been originally sourced.

cheers,
M

 

[Paul_B]

So cool. Never heard of bog iron despite coming from a mineral background. Studied mineral endineering so did geology and metallurgy in huge chunks of my first degree. Makes sense about the myth coming from reality. Afterall a lot of ancient technology was supposed to be in thehands of the elite. Like that archer from near Stonehenge who was buried like a high status person but had the tools of a metalworker on him. Didn't they think he was a metal worker from the alps and that gave him status in ancient Britain?? All I'm saying is that it makes sense for the method of sword making to become a story either as a myth later on or a training from father to son. I can see the archeometalurgist being right on that but no way to really know. I do believe myths to have a degree of truth in them. Not always literally but there is often something that gave them life. A kernal of truth if you like.

 

[R.Lewis]

This is fascinating, really fascinating. I wonder if any of the more experienced knife makers have used it? Would love to see one made from it.

 

[Retired Member southey]

Here's a good read on it dudes Bog iron blog

 

[lannyman8]

hey Toddy, how much of this stuff do you have, or can you get hold of, i would be intrested if you could send me some, i would like to have a play in the forge when i get some time, you would get the finished product (if it turns out ok...)......

if you could PM me with any details that would be great.....

thanks Mary.

chris.

 

[Toddy]

Sorry Chris, I have the water, and can get more, but I don't have any of the iron nodules.
It's something I intend to have a look for though
Apparantly rusty iron bog water with a skim of organic looking oil on top is the kind of bog that produces the iron nodules.

atb,
M

 

[lannyman8]

hhhhhm, seen some of that but cant remember where now......

doh!!!!!

thanks Mary...

chris.

 

[Toddy]

I know where I was doing a walkover survey and managed to step up past my knees in a bog. The farmer claimed, "It's good land that!", and I'm stood there sodden wet thinking, "Aye, for ducks "
That bog had that funny irridescent skin on it. Indeed my trousers are still stained with the iron in the water.

Don't think the farmer would appreciate me digging up his "good land" though

cheers,
M

 

[the interceptor boy]

Have a word with the farmer and tell him that u doing a small project and you need some bog iron to add into making a small knife and if successful you will be presenting him with a similar object and see what he says. Cheers
The interceptor boy.

 

[lannyman8]

I know where I was doing a walkover survey and managed to step up past my knees in a bog. The farmer claimed, "It's good land that!", and I'm stood there sodden wet thinking, "Aye, for ducks "
That bog had that funny irridescent skin on it. Indeed my trousers are still stained with the iron in the water.

Don't think the farmer would appreciate me digging up his "good land" though

cheers,
M

priceless........

shame about the trousers though....

 

[Kotteman]

I have made bog iron 4 times and one thing for sure it's not easy!
My teacher has made about 10-15 "lumps" of bog iron a year for twenty years and he still don't know why sometimes it goes wrong and sometimes right.
The thing is that even if you have the same amount of ore from the same places, heat the furnace for the same amount of time and temperature, the same amount of air intake, the same time and the same weather I can go wrong one time and right one time.

When me and my classmates on that course did the fourth lump of iron we did almost everything wrong. It was to much air and to short time until it was finished but our lump of iron was the best of all the 4 that was made that day.
Out of (I think) 5kg wet ore and 5kg dry ore with 15kg coal an air intake at it's peak 1000l/minute and a finishing time after 1.5h we got out a ca2kg lump that we processed in the smithy for ca1h with a remaining lump weighing 0.8kg now without slag.

One thing that I did not find out until afterwards was that the smith that makes Ray mears hand smith blades, Jule, was their to on the bog iron making course

 

[Toddy]

Kotteman thank you for joining the conversation that's brilliant information

Does the teacher have a website ? or do you know of any others where the bog iron is actually made into something useful ?

cheers,
Toddy

 

[Holme]

There are a few courses this summer on the use of bog iron or "myrmalm" as it is called over here.

Here is a link to Bäckedals Folkhögskola with some pictures from the production. Their course will be held the upcoming week, July 7-10.

http://www.backedal.se/artikel/korta-kurser/från-myrmalm-till-stål-i-smedjan

I believe the course is held in Swedish I'm afraid, but the course comprises the entire chain of producing iron with medieval methods, gathering bog iron, production of charcoal, smelting the bog iron in a dug out kiln and ultimately; blacksmithing the iron. No previous experience is required.

I remember having seen a TV-programme from this class many years ago and it was quite fascinating. Considering all the effort that must be put and how little iron you actually get, You realize how expensive and precious iron was at the time.

 

[lannyman8]

intresting stuff, im thinking of getting the stuff together and have a bash at smelting my own steel, depends on cost though...

thanks for the into...

regards..

chris.

 

[Miyagi]

Very interesting Mary, but not the content I was expecting given the thread title.

Liam xx

 

[Toddy]

Very interesting Mary, but not the content I was expecting given the thread title.

Liam xx

Aye, well, I suppose it was kind of ambiguous

M

 

[Tengu]

Oh, I knew what it was, dont worry

 

[Kotteman]

i went at Bäckendals course last year, the teacher has a website on his own but right now it doesn't work, but this site has a lot of info that you can learn a lot from http://translate.google.com/transla...forntidateknik.z.se/IFT/hammared/hammared.htm roughly translated by google.
The most interesting is the reports on the right from different years.

If you do a calculation about how much Bog iron cost per Kg it's around 6000-7000sek, around 600-700euro per Kg...