How much are women able to carry?

[GuestD]

I'm fully in favour of people expressing their opinions - it helps others identify them for what they are.
No one's challenging your rights and freedoms to express whatever opinions you want. You have full freedom of speech. What you don't have is freedom from repercussions. Expect to be called out on some of your opinions



You're not the only one who works with females. I work in the NHS and my colleagues are predominantly female. And yet I don't seem to have problems navigating respect for them. Maybe you should stop seeing them as something different and try treating them as equals and then you might be a bit more comfortable around them and relax more. Instead you obviously see treating them with respect as a challenge.

Why not bring your sensitive counselling skills to the task?

This "PC" that you talk of, just as a matter of interest, apart from "Daily Mail" reader's, do you have figures of the totals harmed by it. I'm sure all you males out there with female partners who seem to get upset buy "PC" will be quite happy to tell your partners that the money they earn through equality laws, is far too much, and hand it back immediately.

I also have worked for many years in a female environment without any problems. Those of you (males) who work in an all male environment, do you "inadvertently" touch your male colleagues ?

 

[Erbswurst]

I am really surprised that a simple athletic question turns this way here.

What has equal payment (in office jobs) to do with the ability to carry a rucksack at trekking tours ???

Well, we have in Germany some politicians who continue discussing that PC stuff, but the upper middle class stopped discussing that boring stuff round about twenty or thirty years ago. And I didn't hear it in France as well.

I asked in a British forum, and so you have every right to fight out that battle in this thread, but please pardon me, if I don't react to this.

I do not engage me in the Brexit question, not in the Scottish question, not in the Northern Ireland question, not in the question about monarchie or republic, not in other politic British stuff.

I live in France and Germany, and there this PC stuff is over and out. Old fashioned like discussing Communism. Boring to 99% of the people.

SORRY!

 

[demographic]

I recall a recommendation that ladies should wear about 20% less than gentlemen.

Err...

 

[jimbo75]

The Soviet army used a high percentage of female snipers during WW2, apparently because they were ideally suited for the task.

It was only their constant talking that gave their positions away!

 

[Erbswurst]

So, I got the impression that maximal 1/5 of the body weight of an athletic person is the right thumb rule for healthy men and women of every age for a comfortable trekking tour, higher weight is possible and only a question of careful training, lower weight is of course more comfortable for everybody and recommended to less athletic persons.

There is a difference in the muscle structure of men and women that should be counted in, but training and motivation are much more important.

For women the use of a hip belt could be more important than for men, because the female body strength is mainly concentrated in the lower body.

The different skeleton architectur is important and requests special rucksack constructions for women, like funktional clothing for women has to be constructed different as expedition clothing for men.

Our beloved military surplus rucksacks aren't the best recommendation for women so long the armies do not develop special rucksacks for female soldiers, what they seem to discuss currently.

Because women are round about 20% smaller than men, a very rough thumb rule says, that women should carry round about 20% less than men.
But the rule that with maximal 1/5 of the body weight of athletic persons most people feel comfortable is the better way to calculate the weight of the rucksack.

Because the muscle structure of men and women is different, it is probably intelligent to give a man maximal 20% of his bodyweight but the women maximal 15% or 18%.

Careful training allowes both, men like women, to carry much more, but for civilians with probably office jobs this seems to be the right recommendation.

Did I understand it right?

Does that fit together with your experiences?

 

[santaman2000]

I’m intrigued as to which of my comments on this thread you regard as “PC” which seems to simply have become a term of abuse to be hurled at anyone you disagree with.

I have not at any point denied that on average men are bigger than women or that “a good big ‘un will usually beat a good little ‘un”, just that without a clear understanding of all the variables, offering anything other than very general advice in an individual case is pretty meaningless......



......The woman managed a similar route last year and the year before so it is not unreasonable to assume that she would be up for it this year. In contrast, AFAIK none of the 25000 forum posts from the other candidates include any evidence of recent hillwalking experience the decision for me would be a no brainer plus a decent day out.....

Apparently we agree ..... somewhat. No, you never said that bigger people (men or women) couldn’t carry more (or that they weren’t generally stronger) Normdid I say that there weren’t women who were equally in condition or of a size to match men physically.

However what was inferred by most of your comments was that MOST women meet that criteria. What was inferred in mine (and specifically stated at least once) was that while that was true, such was far from being “normal.” The PC aspect is the idea that men and women are “equal” physically (size,musculature, strength) Certain individuals? Yes. As a normal majority? Not even close.

You would be correct in assuming I have no recent “hill” walking experience. To be honest I can’t recall ever walking hills of any size. My altitude experience was both long ago and not hills. It was about 40 years ago when I was stationed in Nevada for 5 years and hunted and explored the Humbolt Mountains and the Mojave Desert Of southern Nevada. My recent outdoor experience (the last 30 years) has been mostly the swamps and heat of NW Florida.

I too know many country women who can handle an axe and bothe country and city women who are proficient with a chainsaw. That said. Neither require large muscle groups; but rather good muscle tone and muscle memory as well as experience with technique. Much the same reason I was able to teach my daughter good defense tactics such as marksmanship and situational awareness (although her body types makes it more challenging to carry concealed)

 

[santaman2000]

This "PC" that you talk of, just as a matter of interest, apart from "Daily Mail" reader's, do you have figures of the totals harmed by it. I'm sure all you males out there with female partners who seem to get upset buy "PC" will be quite happy to tell your partners that the money they earn through equality laws, is far too much, and hand it back immediately.

I also have worked for many years in a female environment without any problems. Those of you (males) who work in an all male environment, do you "inadvertently" touch your male colleagues ?

Actually the fairest pay systems I’ve worked with involved being paid for the actual work done:

-Back before the gigantic round bales took over the hay market the norm was the smaller square bales you moved by hand. Farmers paid teenagers to haul those bales from the field where they were bailed to the storage barns. We were paid by the bale.

-Likewise when harvesting watermelons we were paid by the pound.

-When cotton was still pinched by hand the pickers were also paid by the pound.

-Still today those who do auto body work are paid but the “job standard” (an hourly rate for the time determined to be the national average for a given task)


In all those cases personal bias is removed. Either you can and do, do the work or you do not.

 

[Herman30]

Janne said: ↑
I recall a recommendation that ladies should wear about 20% less than gentlemen.

So that means...if I´m wearing only shorts a lady shoud wear only...hmm...socks?

 

[Erbswurst]

No, if you wear shorts and T-shirt, she should wear a bikini.

(But not in Finland, because you have this horribly midges.)

 

[santaman2000]

.....I also have worked for many years in a female environment without any problems. Those of you (males) who work in an all male environment, do you "inadvertently" touch your male colleagues ?

Rather depends on the type work. Janne’s Comment was more about his patients. I have a hard time imagining a dentist NOT touching his patients often. I also have a hard time imagining a quarterback not putting his hands on the center’s butt to receive the snap. Or a youth coach not patting his students. Or the level of hazing GIs are allowed for new recruits (and no, I’m not buying the arguments dismissing military members as not being part of normal society —— rather I dismiss opinions from those who have never served)

 

[Janne]

Santaman. That is correct.

Erbswurst, you mention the Bunderwehr are developing a backpack for females?

 

[GuestD]

Rather depends on the type work. Janne’s Comment was more about his patients. I have a hard time imagining a dentist NOT touching his patients often. I also have a hard time imagining a quarterback not putting his hands on the center’s butt to receive the snap. Or a youth coach not patting his students. Or the level of hazing GIs are allowed for new recruits (and no, I’m not buying the arguments dismissing military members as not being part of normal society —— rather I dismiss opinions from those who have never served)

you've got me fluctuating between the Simpsons and Southpark.

 

[Janne]

You - Monty Python?

( I see myself as a spiritual brother of Dave Allen)

For a comfortable and successful carrying experience, the backpack has to adjusted and packed very carefully.
A light, but badly adjusted and packed one is incredibly tiring.

 

[GuestD]

You - Monty Python?

( I see myself as a spiritual brother of Dave Allen)

 

[Janne]

And the whiskey?



I rate him as one of the foremost comedians. Just ahead of Tommy Cooper.

Is that photo of him as young?

 

[santaman2000]

you've got me fluctuating between the Simpsons and Southpark.

Both are funny, but getting back to reality, my post stands. We’re talking about normal blue collar workers, not necessarily just office workers.

 

[GuestD]

We’re talking about normal blue collar workers, not necessarily just office workers.

I'm not. More about unacceptable and out dated attitudes.

 

[oldtimer]

Erbswurst: I bet you didn't envisage your enquiry running to six pages already and so many entertaining side-alleys!

I've heard it said that the Germans lack a sense of humour. You demonstrate that this is, of course, racist nonsense. However, I am beginning to realise that Teutonic and Scandinavian humour is different and the more I experience it here, the more I understand it, and the more I understand it, the more I enjoy it. I'm already up to speed with French humour as I have a lot of French friends and now I have even more to enjoy because of the posts by Americans, Canadians, Swedes, Finns, Dutch and French contributors.

Laugh and the world laughs with you and vice versa. It used to be that one had to travel to have one's mind broadened. Now one can do it at home on the computer.

 

[santaman2000]

I'm not. More about unacceptable and out dated attitudes.

Not an attitude. Just reality. Whether you accept it or not is irrelevant. New age “datedness” is Likewise irrelevant.

 

[GuestD]

Not an attitude. Just reality. Whether you accept it or not is irrelevant. New age “datedness” is Likewise irrelevant.

goes both ways too.