Time/Distance calculations.

[Quixoticgeek]

Been pondering a lot of routes and plans recently, and as such have been pondering ways of guestimating the time it will take to do a specific distance. Naismiths Rule is the obvious candidate, and it kinda works for me in the lowlands of Kent. But the moment any half reasonable incline happens, or I add 5-10kg of pack, it falls apart. On a recent hike that involved a large quantity of stairs, my horizontal speed was so low my gps didn't even register me as moving...

What techniques/numbers/fudge factors do you use for trying to work out how long a route might take you ?

J

 

[woodsorrel]

Hi Quixoticgeek!

When I did serious land navigation, I marked out a flat quarter mile and walked it. I timed my journey and counted paces. Once I had my pace I used it (adjusted) for estimating my time over various routes. You could use a GPS or the odometer in your car to measure a distance and do the same thing.

But that is not what I do today! I'm not that "serious." In the U.S., many of us use 2.0 miles per hour as the average person's walking pace. I'm embarrassed to say that I hike around 2.5 mph regardless of terrain. Using the 2.0 number for day hikes does well for me over most terrains. I omit the time for my lunch stop and still have a good amount of safety margin. For overnight trips when I'm carrying a full pack, I use the 2.0 number but add-in time for lunch and additional margin.

I find the adjusted 2.0 mph number works well for both route selection and estimating my position. I wish I could use my old 3.5 mph number... <sigh>

I hope this helps!

- Woodsorrel

 

[beezer]

i usually move at around 2 miles per hour including breaks over a days walk . i just figured by how long it takes me cover a good distance in a day (10-18 miles). then compare it to other routes i have done and over different ground. your days average speed is way more important than a speed at any one time, were all slow going up. try not to get to hung up on your speed and make shore you have a good time.

could you send me up a good micro pub or two to scotland please.

 

[Limaed]

I use Naismiths Rule for planning the whole day then break down individual legs as required. Over rough ground I find 4 kmph and 30 seconds per contour about right for me. The maths can be quite complicated though so I carry a card with some of the basic figures in my map case. On steep uniform hills an easy maths solution is to drop off the last zero and don't bother with the distance eg 400 m ascent = 40 mins in total, this is quite a quick pace though.
Timing is very much based ona variety of factors including fitness, load, ground conditions, weather, day or night so its probably best to find your own pace. Some ideas and kit from here may help: http://shavenraspberry.com/

 

[bearbait]

Search Tranter's Corrections to Naismiths's Rule.

I'm sure you're already aware of this but the map shows horizontal distance. As soon as you get onto a decent gradient the distance you hike is greater than the horiz. distance shown on the map, so as well as likely going slower on the grade you're hiking further too. For example a 30 degree slope increase your distance travelled by 15%. (Naismith's, of course, takes this generally into account already.)

Hiking with one or more buddies can slow you down/speed you up according to their fitness, stops for photos/scenery/etc.

See if you can get/borrow a copy of the Mountaincraft & Leadership book. Has loads (or had: mine's 1984 vintage!) of good stuff on this topic., e.g. "A heavy pack can reduce progress by 50% of unladen speed, taking into account additional rest periods as well as speed over the ground. It is best to allow for this by simply estimating a slower speed, say 3 kph or even 2 kph in some circumstances."

Another consideration is how high you're hiking. For example, in North America you may be starting your hike at 8,000 feet or more and so altitude and its effects will impact your speed until you become more acclimatised. Temperature is another factor.

If you are in to tech. do a few sample and representative hikes, appropriately laden, with a hiker's GPS and note what it tells you for subsequent planning. Or even a wrist watch!

Or just do it...and enjoy the time spent on the trail!

 

[petrochemicals]

Without a bag on the pavement 5mph over long disistances is about the maximum. Wit a pack of any reasonable weight, over flat ground, on a flat smooth surface with good conditions, you can get about 4mph over a considerable distance. If you add a hill or decent, as I find both as bad as each other, take it down to 3mph, add rough ground 2 mph, add a heavy bag or slippery conditions 1 mph. Long vegitation no path you're looking at standing pace.

I find on hill assents the pack weighs on my shoulders, and on the decents, it weighs on my spine. Rough ground plays havoc with my knees because of balance, and slippery conditions/heavy weight slow me because of insecurities about my footing. Each time take 1mph off. That's why the Romans built long flat straight roads for the troops to walk on!

 

[tiger stacker]

15-20 minutes to the mile is average for active folk on good surface. As others state your speed slows down when resistance factors come into play bad ground babys heads Rannoch Moor etc etc. Army being the army likes to tab/march/ double quicktime, with interesting loads leading to character strength being found.
West highland way can be enjoyed over four days, with each leg broken down to 23ish miles. That can be interpreted as 3mph over 8 hours on good walking track.

 

[Folcwigga]

The way i do it is to find the distance and ascent over the course of the route, divide it by Naismith's rule (3 mph, and 2,000' ph), then add on how long i think i'll be stopping to eat/take pics/etc, and then on top of that i'll just add a generous fudge factor depending on how rough i think the ground will be or how much i think i'll need to stop and recover. It's not exactly scientific, but once you have a feel for your own pace in various conditions i find it accurate enough for my purposes anyway.

 

[tsitenha]

More primitive than all, hike, canoe all day, camp at leisure/dusk. In nature there is no clock or me.

 

[honisoitquimalypense]

the key to all this timings is trial and error. pace 100m no more or less. use your local running track and do it in your boots and with a decent pack while nobody is around and count your double paces. as often as you can when you go out use a 1=25k map measure distances easy with the romer on the compass and see how long it takes you. in time you will know when you are flying along on the flat or good day at 6k per hr or the opposite slightly uphill into a head wind with a few beers the night before and struggling to hit the 2k mark. finally get used to working on height gain at 1 min per contour in mountains as it real quick and easy you can count the thick ones 5 apart and add any bits on the end. so 3 thick contours and maybe 1 at one end and a couple at the other. 18mins for height gain to add.. thats the MLTB summer and winter way. good luck. stay safe.

 

[petrochemicals]

More primitive than all, hike, canoe all day, camp at leisure/dusk. In nature there is no clock or me.

Yup I agree, that is nice, especially I you can pick up food on the way. The ideal and very draw of all that I bushcraft i would say tsitenha. But in the uk it can be problematic to get food or hunt enroute, as it isnt running with animals to take. Or land to camp on. You lucky so and so.

 

[Tonyuk]

I've always worked on 20mins per KM as a leisurely pace. If you have a fair bit of climbing to do then as mentioned factor in Naismith's rule.

Tonyuk

 

[Ogri the trog]

The actual number you use within Naismiths Rule is completely up to you and will only approach accuracy if you perpetually adjust for the type of terrain, weight you carry and so on.
But take this adjustment further, by allowing your progress to be somewhat slower, later in the day as you get tired - if it still proves to be difficult, plan in several breaks so that you can take them or choose to ignore them to keep to your appointed stage times.

ATB

Ogri the trog

 

[rg598]

I just know my general speed over different types of terrain, so I can guesstimate how long it will take me to travel a particular distance. It is hard to do the math just based on a map. While incline will change your speed, so will density of vegetation, the type of soil, etc. Generally I factor in a speed of 2mph for a good trail, 1mph for difficult trail or easy bushwhacking, and 0.5mph for bushwhacking through dense vegetation.